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Post by topshelfmg on Apr 2, 2017 0:51:34 GMT -6
I recently got a tube driven Spring Reverb from Tone Bakery, and it sounds great! Absolutely beautiful sounding besides a hum I'm going to get worked out with Bowie, and they are sending me two more medium decay tanks to try out (since they accidentally set it with the wrong tank opposed to the two that are on the way). When I get the medium decay tanks, I'll be able to use it on way more sources.
ANYWAYS, I am using it with a Radial EXTC 500, and when I turn the send up to over 20% or so, an audible high pitched squeak / buzz comes from the reverb unit itself, but doesn't seem to come through the monitors during the playback. Even with very moderate input levels, it makes this noise that seems to be timed with the audio running through it. Anyone know what this may be? A bad / damaged during shipping reverb tank? I was thinking maybe a microphonic tube, but since it isn't showing up during playback, it's just audible noise in the room itself coming from the unit, I do not think that is the case.
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Post by topshelfmg on Apr 2, 2017 1:45:54 GMT -6
If this narrows it down, I can actually faintly make out the words from the vocals I am running through the unit in the buzz.
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Post by stratboy on Apr 2, 2017 9:12:44 GMT -6
Sounds like the send transducer in the tank is microphonic. When you get the other tanks, you can test that theory.
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Post by topshelfmg on Apr 2, 2017 12:33:58 GMT -6
Sounds like the send transducer in the tank is microphonic. When you get the other tanks, you can test that theory. So if that is the case, it is just a matter of putting in a new tank? Hopefully that's it then. |
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Post by drbill on Apr 2, 2017 13:33:32 GMT -6
That is an electro mechanical unit. Stuff is physically "moving" inside to make your reverb. I would be more worried if it didn't make any noise. Locate it out of earshot and all is good, right? That's what we used to do with plates, and chambers and springs.
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Post by topshelfmg on Apr 2, 2017 13:52:26 GMT -6
That is an electro mechanical unit. Stuff is physically "moving" inside to make your reverb. I would be more worried if it didn't make any noise. Locate it out of earshot and all is good, right? That's what we used to do with plates, and chambers and springs. Good point, but a friend has the Little Walter TubeVerb which is an extremely similar design and it doesn't make a peep, regardless of how hard you drive it. That's what leads me to believe something isn't right. |
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Post by topshelfmg on Apr 2, 2017 14:01:12 GMT -6
That is an electro mechanical unit. Stuff is physically "moving" inside to make your reverb. I would be more worried if it didn't make any noise. Locate it out of earshot and all is good, right? That's what we used to do with plates, and chambers and springs. Also, unfortunately until I move into my new facility in the next couple months, it's pretty much stuck within ear shot. I have a feeling a change of thank will at least attenuate the noise. |
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Post by johneppstein on Apr 2, 2017 14:38:21 GMT -6
Sounds like the send transducer in the tank is microphonic. When you get the other tanks, you can test that theory. Er, not exactly. I agree that is definitely sounds like the send transducer. What I don't agree is that it's "microphonic". The send transducer is, functionally, a miniature speaker. (it operates in a radial manner, not linear (IIRC), and it's moving magnet not moving coil, but it's still functionally a speaker.) Speakers don't go microphonic. What it could be is that the transducer could be slightly out of alignment and the magnetic slug is rubbing against the surrounding core laminations when it's excited beyond a certain point. Alternately you might just be driving it too hard. Reverb tanks are made with the transducers aligned for particular mounting orientations, springs up, springs down, side up, end up, etc, to compensate for the effects of gravity on the springs. It could be that the tank was intended for a different orientation (the orientation is designated in the model number, along with impedance, number and length of springs, and reverb time), or it could have been knocked out of alignment by excessively rough handling. If you're careful and know what you're doing it IS possible to realign a transducer by shimming it for a slightly different amount of direction of tilt. The object is to get the rotating magnetic slug perfectly centered in the laminations that transmit the magnetic field of the coil to the slug when the tank is in the orientation in which it will be used. However since the unit is new I would contact the company before attempting surgery on the tank. And, as I said, you may simply be driving it too hard. Another possibility is you might just be hearing the movement of the springs. If you don't hear misalignment artifacts in the resulting reverb this is a definite possibility, especially if the tank is not mounted in a naugahyde pouch, as Fender did in their original amps. (I don't know if they still do, they've cut so many corners...) Amplified parts sells reverb bags, as well as various tanks, etc. www.amplifiedparts.com/products/reverb_tanks |
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Post by stratboy on Apr 3, 2017 17:33:15 GMT -6
Sounds like the send transducer in the tank is microphonic. When you get the other tanks, you can test that theory. Er, not exactly. I agree that is definitely sounds like the send transducer. What I don't agree is that it's "microphonic". The send transducer is, functionally, a miniature speaker. (it operates in a radial manner, not linear (IIRC), and it's moving magnet not moving coil, but it's still functionally a speaker.) Speakers don't go microphonic. What it could be is that the transducer could be slightly out of alignment and the magnetic slug is rubbing against the surrounding core laminations when it's excited beyond a certain point. Alternately you might just be driving it too hard. Reverb tanks are made with the transducers aligned for particular mounting orientations, springs up, springs down, side up, end up, etc, to compensate for the effects of gravity on the springs. It could be that the tank was intended for a different orientation (the orientation is designated in the model number, along with impedance, number and length of springs, and reverb time), or it could have been knocked out of alignment by excessively rough handling. If you're careful and know what you're doing it IS possible to realign a transducer by shimming it for a slightly different amount of direction of tilt. The object is to get the rotating magnetic slug perfectly centered in the laminations that transmit the magnetic field of the coil to the slug when the tank is in the orientation in which it will be used. However since the unit is new I would contact the company before attempting surgery on the tank. And, as I said, you may simply be driving it too hard. Another possibility is you might just be hearing the movement of the springs. If you don't hear misalignment artifacts in the resulting reverb this is a definite possibility, especially if the tank is not mounted in a naugahyde pouch, as Fender did in their original amps. (I don't know if they still do, they've cut so many corners...) Amplified parts sells reverb bags, as well as various tanks, etc. www.amplifiedparts.com/products/reverb_tanksTechnically, you are correct. I was using the word to shorthand the point that the send transfuser is the culprit. Like you, I don't think tank surgery is the way to go. If his tank is bad, substitution and elimination will reveal it. Good thought on the bag. I didn't know you could get those any more. |
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Post by jcoutu1 on May 31, 2017 12:45:28 GMT -6
That is an electro mechanical unit. Stuff is physically "moving" inside to make your reverb. I would be more worried if it didn't make any noise. Locate it out of earshot and all is good, right? That's what we used to do with plates, and chambers and springs. Also, unfortunately until I move into my new facility in the next couple months, it's pretty much stuck within ear shot. I have a feeling a change of thank will at least attenuate the noise. Ever get this thing sorted? |
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Post by topshelfmg on Jun 9, 2017 0:46:55 GMT -6
Also, unfortunately until I move into my new facility in the next couple months, it's pretty much stuck within ear shot. I have a feeling a change of thank will at least attenuate the noise. Ever get this thing sorted? I took it into my tech and a big part of it is how it's designed, and each reverb tank makes a big difference to the output level. If it's too quiet, I have to turn down the send a bunch to not overload the tank, and then crank the output to make up for it, which also cranks the noise floor. Unfortunately, the manufacturer was unable to supply us with any schematics or useful specs, so we were really unable to do a lot, and I determined it wasn't worth the money poking around in the dark. If I do get schematics or something for my tech, I was going to add Jenson transformer balanced ins and outs that were purposes for line level, but currently, that isn't realistic. Till I do that, I don't find it worth it to build a new box to have the 4+ tanks wired at once with a switcher, so essentially I'll just use it as a guitar pedal in the meantime. For that, and in general, it still sounds great. Just noisy. The Little Walter Tube Amp TubeVerb doesn't have these problems, but it is also 3 times the price, so that makes sense. |
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Post by johneppstein on Jun 9, 2017 1:59:40 GMT -6
Ever get this thing sorted? I took it into my tech and a big part of it is how it's designed, and each reverb tank makes a big difference to the output level. If it's too quiet, I have to turn down the send a bunch to not overload the tank, and then crank the output to make up for it, which also cranks the noise floor. Unfortunately, the manufacturer was unable to supply us with any schematics or useful specs, so we were really unable to do a lot, and I determined it wasn't worth the money poking around in the dark. If I do get schematics or something for my tech, I was going to add Jenson transformer balanced ins and outs that were purposes for line level, but currently, that isn't realistic. Till I do that, I don't find it worth it to build a new box to have the 4+ tanks wired at once with a switcher, so essentially I'll just use it as a guitar pedal in the meantime. For that, and in general, it still sounds great. Just noisy. The Little Walter Tube Amp TubeVerb doesn't have these problems, but it is also 3 times the price, so that makes sense. If it's truly a clone of the Fender tube spring reverb the schematics are readily available on the internet, both versions. If you have trouble finding them (google "fender tube reverb schematic") I can send them to you. |
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