|
Post by ragan on Nov 16, 2016 6:53:39 GMT -6
I agree. I usually just monitor it through my Apollo and add the emulation in post afterward. I have a dual core, so there are pops and other artifacts if I turn my buffer down to 64. I think both of these sound good, but one is a FET 67 and the other an emulation of a modded 67, so they sound different. The FG67 was the most disappointing emulation when I first heard it, because it was marketed as a U67 Emu, but is really bright in comparison. Steven Slate later advised that the U67 being emulated had had it's filters removed. Yeah. I knew that too, it's just the closest thing I've got to any of the VMS emulations. I've got the "intensity" up on the FG-67 a good ways, maybe 140% or something, which thickens it and brings it closer to the 3U.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Nov 16, 2016 9:14:31 GMT -6
Yeah. I knew that too, it's just the closest thing I've got to any of the VMS emulations. I've got the "intensity" up on the FG-67 a good ways, maybe 140% or something, which thickens it and brings it closer to the 3U. I'm planning a big video shootout with the VMS and the tribute mics in my locker, and possibly Mic Mod EFX & IK Mic Room. I just have to find the time to do it. It's my busy performance season and I haven't had a free weekend since Sept. Hopefully I'll find the time after Thanksgiving. Also, the guys at Advanced Audio were so impressed with the shoot out I did with their mics (posted in another thread), they are going to send me a couple of their new mics to demo and post some stuff online. We're trying to figure out the timing on this. They have a vocal head for their 1084 style mic designed for loud sources, like my operatic tenor. They also have a (3) polar pattern mic based on the U48 coming out too. When I get the CM48T I'll do a shoot out with VMS and my Peluso 2247SE. That should be fun.
|
|
|
Post by henge on Nov 16, 2016 12:10:18 GMT -6
Both sound great and are usable. The depth and size seems to be pretty equal on both takes.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 16, 2016 13:43:28 GMT -6
...the depth and size seems to be pretty equal on both takes. Not to my ear but this stuff is pretty subjective.
|
|
|
Post by wiz on Nov 16, 2016 14:00:09 GMT -6
Both sound really good. Can you post the other VMS mics like 251 and 47 with that take please when you have a chance... thats where the beauty of this thing will lie.. post tracking. What was it like, as a vocalist singing through the slate system in terms of latency and vibe, compared to the GZ and real pre? thats the other big consideration.. cheers Wiz Yeah I can definitely do that. It'll be tomorrow though. As far as the experience of it, if I go down to 64 buffer, I can get the PT monitoring to almost feel good. If I couldn't AB between the UAD Console app and the DAW monitoring, I'd probably be satisfied with it. But as it is, I just monitor through Console because it's way more immediate. Also, 64 buffer precludes things on some people's systems, resource wise. And that all assumes you don't have any plugin that's introducing even a spec of latency. For me, it's analog or something like UAD Console for monitoring. thanks for the reply... whats it like, monitoring the mic flat? just through your UAD console... is that possible? whats the sound like? Idea being, no latency. cheers Wiz
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Nov 16, 2016 14:22:42 GMT -6
thanks for the reply... whats it like, monitoring the mic flat? just through your UAD console... is that possible? whats the sound like? Idea being, no latency. cheers Wiz It sounds very clean and neutral. Not overly bright and not overly warm.
|
|
|
Post by Guitar on Nov 16, 2016 15:51:36 GMT -6
Wow, ragan great shootouts on your soundcloud! I thought the U87 sounded spectacular, but the 3U mics sounded great. I also liked the VMS in this comparison. Hard to pick a favorite they all seem pretty neat to have and use. At very different price points, as well.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 16, 2016 16:37:39 GMT -6
Wow, ragan great shootouts on your soundcloud! I thought the U87 sounded spectacular, but the 3U mics sounded great. I also liked the VMS in this comparison. Hard to pick a favorite they all seem pretty neat to have and use. At very different price points, as well. Thanks. I didn't really discover the right placement for either the MKID or the GZ67 for my voice until recently, so the shootouts with the U87 aren't as good sounding (to me) vocally. But of course it's an even playing field because the U87 was always capsule to capsule wherever the 3U mic was. I've never been in love with U87s enough to pull the trigger (though actually, I did 'buy' one once off the GC Used site but it turned out it was both messed up and already sold to someone else) but they're obviously excellent mics.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 16, 2016 17:19:16 GMT -6
Yeah I can definitely do that. It'll be tomorrow though. As far as the experience of it, if I go down to 64 buffer, I can get the PT monitoring to almost feel good. If I couldn't AB between the UAD Console app and the DAW monitoring, I'd probably be satisfied with it. But as it is, I just monitor through Console because it's way more immediate. Also, 64 buffer precludes things on some people's systems, resource wise. And that all assumes you don't have any plugin that's introducing even a spec of latency. For me, it's analog or something like UAD Console for monitoring. thanks for the reply... whats it like, monitoring the mic flat? just through your UAD console... is that possible? whats the sound like? Idea being, no latency. cheers Wiz Yeah it works just like any other mic since without the software applied, it's just an analog mic and pre. It's not bad at all monitoring the vanilla mic/pre. Flat, a little bright (edge terminated capsule) but not harsh. Definitely workable, especially since with the UAD console I can pull up an EQ or comp with some color and vibe it up for monitoring. PS I've got some more clips to post for you of the other models and the flat mic with that same take from last night all going through the same chain.
|
|
|
Post by henge on Nov 16, 2016 21:33:10 GMT -6
...the depth and size seems to be pretty equal on both takes. Not to my ear but this stuff is pretty subjective. Hmm gotta listen in the studio, I was listening over phones
|
|
|
Post by henge on Nov 16, 2016 21:39:52 GMT -6
...the depth and size seems to be pretty equal on both takes. Not to my ear but this stuff is pretty subjective. Had another listen over phones. VMS does sound flatter but brighter.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 16, 2016 23:48:11 GMT -6
Here you go wiz (or anyone else). Same take with the various emulations. https%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-fg-47-vocalhttps%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-fg-251-vocalhttps%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-fg-269-vocalhttps%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-no-emulation
|
|
|
Post by ChaseUTB on Nov 17, 2016 0:23:58 GMT -6
Vox mic A and Vox mic B is the gz67fet vs the tlm67? I feel B is more balanced in this comparison however both are usable. I preferred the gz67fet against the Slate emulation. The Slate is very bright for a 67 and I know it was modeled off a 67 that had the top opened up and not stock. I liked the Slate a bit better on the guitar. ragan do you have the I/o audio tlm67 mod kit ? How do you like the tlm 67? When u belt the " Who's gonna wait " part the Slate mic sounds or gets flat like it hits a brick wall on the nonemulation take, I am interested to hear what the software does to this part. Ya I didn't think software could correct that, the 251 made it a little better by hyping the high frequencies, 2-5khz region but it still sounded flat like it couldn't handle the transition. Thanks for taking the time to do this comparison for us here. I think people who are interested in this mic system can learn a lot from you and Vincent R's posts.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 17, 2016 0:35:13 GMT -6
Vox mic A and Vox mic B is the gz67fet vs the tlm67? I feel B is more balanced in this comparison however both are usable. I preferred the gz67fet against the Slate emulation. The Slate is very bright for a 67 and I know it was modeled off a 67 that had the top opened up and not stock. I liked the Slate a bit better on the guitar. ragan do you have the I/o audio tlm67 mod kit ? How do you like the tlm 67? When u belt the " Who's gonna wait " part the Slate mic sounds or gets flat like it hits a brick wall on the nonemulation take, I am interested to hear what the software does to this part. Ya I didn't think software could correct that, the 251 made it a little better by hyping the high frequencies, 2-5khz region but it still sounded flat like it couldn't handle the transition. Thanks for taking the time to do this comparison for us here. I think people who are interested in this mic system can learn a lot from you and Vincent R's posts. You're going way back to the summer on me there with the TLM67 Had to look up the note on my phone. A is the TLM67, B is the GZ67Fet. I returned the TLM67. In most cases I preferred the GZ67Fet to it, though I did like certain things about it (the TLM67). It's a nice mic, but so is the GZ67Fet and the GZ is like 25% of the cost of the TLM. For me, I don't like the 251 emulation on my voice at all. I have a pretty strident, brash voice. Always been a challenge to track.
|
|
|
Post by wiz on Nov 17, 2016 1:09:52 GMT -6
First can i say a huge thanks for posting all those for me, thats so cool of you.. thats a fair bit of work there bud.
I agree with you on the 251, not the go for this.
The 269 and the slate on its own, sound pretty damn cool.
I know lots of people are bagging it, but I gotta say, at sub grand US for mic and preamps, and the software, hard to dismiss IMHO. I have paid more than that for MICS I ended up not liking at all very much.
thanks again.
I would love to demo one myself.
If I was recording different singers day and and day out.. I would buy this right now.
cheers
Wiz
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 17, 2016 1:49:12 GMT -6
First can i say a huge thanks for posting all those for me, thats so cool of you.. thats a fair bit of work there bud. I agree with you on the 251, not the go for this. The 269 and the slate on its own, sound pretty damn cool. I know lots of people are bagging it, but I gotta say, at sub grand US for mic and preamps, and the software, hard to dismiss IMHO. I have paid more than that for MICS I ended up not liking at all very much. thanks again. I would love to demo one myself. If I was recording different singers day and and day out.. I would buy this right now. cheers Wiz No problem at all, mate. I think the VMS is a really cool product. I don't think it's quite for me, but I do think it could be just the ticket for a lot of folks in a lot of situations. I realized a bit ago I forgot to run one with the C12 emulation. I'll do that tomorrow, it's maybe my favorite of the VMS bunch actually.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Nov 17, 2016 9:55:09 GMT -6
Here's a comparison between the Slate VMS FG-67 and the 3U Audio GZ67Fet. The VMS 67 is using the VMS 1073 and the GZ67Fet is going through a Heritage DMA-73. https%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/3u-audio-gz67fet-vs-vms-fg-67-vocalhttps%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-67-vs-gz67-vocalJust got a chance to listen on the monitors. I think the 3U (which is impressive if you ask me) has a little more bottom and the tiniest bit less strident in the mids. Either one would be great though. Cool song and singing!
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Nov 17, 2016 9:58:30 GMT -6
Wow, the Slate sounds better than I thought it would. That being said, it's kind've like I thought it would be - not a humongous difference between the mics - just sounds like EQ tweaks to me. But you're right - this thing would be great for - actually someone like me - someone that can't afford a whole mic locker.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 17, 2016 10:12:34 GMT -6
Here's a comparison between the Slate VMS FG-67 and the 3U Audio GZ67Fet. The VMS 67 is using the VMS 1073 and the GZ67Fet is going through a Heritage DMA-73. https%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/3u-audio-gz67fet-vs-vms-fg-67-vocalhttps%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-67-vs-gz67-vocalJust got a chance to listen on the monitors. I think the 3U (which is impressive if you ask me) has a little more bottom and the tiniest bit less strident in the mids. Either one would be great though. Cool song and singing! Thanks. It's a Bob Seger song, for the record (er, a minute of a Bob Seger song). I remain extremely impressed with the 3U mics. The VMS is cool though, if you can get into the workflow. I did several blind tests on myself before posting anything and I always prefer the 3U/real pre stuff. Like you, I was surprised how good the VMS sounds but I always hear some flatness. You can hear it on the guitars only clip I think. To me, it's very similar to the results I get every time I carefully AB plugin emulations to real hardware. And in that same way, you can certainly make a nice production with the software, but my ear wants the real thing. BUT. Versatility wise? VMS is a helluva tool.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2016 10:46:38 GMT -6
Thanks Ragan, great demo. Real thing is king.
|
|
|
Post by Johnkenn on Nov 17, 2016 12:11:06 GMT -6
I know me, and I would be bummed to have to use the VMS mic pre all the time. Whether or not it sounds exactly the same (and it's really close) I would always have that nagging thing in the back of my mind.
|
|
|
Post by Vincent R. on Nov 17, 2016 12:45:16 GMT -6
I know me, and I would be bummed to have to use the VMS mic pre all the time. Whether or not it sounds exactly the same (and it's really close) I would always have that nagging thing in the back of my mind. I use my UAD preamps more often than the Slate Pres. I prefer the NEVE 88RS to the 1073 or V76 for the music I do. Also, no one is to say that the emulation won't work if recorded through your actual preamp. It will be different and not how it's designed, but the emulation will still alter the sound, probably for the better. Or, sometimes I'll run the signal through a preamp after the fact. Yes, you get additional AD/DA conversion, but it works.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 17, 2016 13:34:07 GMT -6
Here's the C12 emulation that I forgot to run with that vocal. It's probably my favorite of the VMS emulations, which surprised me. It's mellower than the 251 emu with more low mid weight, which is kind of the opposite of how I think of those two mic brothers.
https%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-fg12-vocal
|
|
|
Post by jcoutu1 on Nov 17, 2016 13:56:43 GMT -6
Here's the C12 emulation that I forgot to run with that vocal. It's probably my favorite of the VMS emulations, which surprised me. It's mellower than the 251 emu with more low mid weight, which is kind of the opposite of how I think of those two mic brothers. https%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-fg12-vocalI feel like the 3U works best with your voice. The FG12 still seems to have too much push and the 47 seems to pull out too much push.
|
|
|
Post by ragan on Nov 17, 2016 14:14:43 GMT -6
Here's the C12 emulation that I forgot to run with that vocal. It's probably my favorite of the VMS emulations, which surprised me. It's mellower than the 251 emu with more low mid weight, which is kind of the opposite of how I think of those two mic brothers. https%3A//soundcloud.com/fir_out/vms-fg12-vocalI feel like the 3U works best with your voice. The FG12 still seems to have too much push and the 47 seems to pull out too much push. Yeah, I absolutely prefer the 3U, both because I think the VMS emulations are just a little flat compared to real mics and because its voicing is a better match for me. The GZ67Fet is probably the best match I've found for my voice out of probably 2 dozen mics I've had through here in the last few years. [Edit: I actually just did some more testing last night and I think the MKID is the better fit. Not that anyone gives a shit about that, but I like accuracy] The clip I posted is no EQ (except some HPF). I know I'm a broken record about it, but 3U is excellent stuff.
|
|