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Post by rocinante on Dec 6, 2015 1:33:09 GMT -6
I love owning a bad ass pro/home studio. Its a dream I had when I was touring throughout my twenties and also while interning in a few facilities in NY. That said its nothing compared to listening to a crowd of 400 plus sing some heartfelt lyrics you wrote along with you as you passionately play for them. Words can't express it. It's addictive too. I spent a decade and all I have to show for it is a story or ten and head full of memories. But that's fine. Cause it was great. And they are great memories. And what are we but a collection of memories? Its sad to think so many bands have no idea what that is like cause they're hoping the video they have on YouTube gets a lot of hits. I have had a dozen clients in the last few years whose claim to fame is how many YouTube hits they have. A few tried to record at home and were smart enough to realize it didn't sound very good so did the next best thing; recorded at someone else's home. A few had me fix the stuff they had recorded and usually after a bit realize how bad their recordings were and just have me redo the whole thing. Then its either off to renting a gopro or having us help with the video too. And then YouTube. Friggin youtube. Ugg. I rarely ever hear of or from them again. On the flipside I recorded and mixed an album done by a NOLA based band of buskers whose tunes were foot stomping and fantastic. They rarely play to a crowd of over 20 people yet they rock and are incredibly talented musicians. They have no interest in lasting longer than a year and then off to another project/adventure. Ten songs took two days to record, two days to mix, and off they went. I gave them the websites of a few mastering engineers but never heard from them again.
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Post by M57 on Dec 6, 2015 5:01:35 GMT -6
If today's music is "tight but dull," it's been a meaningful progression. In the day, I wasn't part of the scene, so my information is that of the common fan but I recall hearing about and believing that the obsession with tightness in the studio began with Steely Dan. I'm not saying they were the 'only', but I'll put it out there as a benchmark. Their work included fabulous play from drummers like Gadd, so the life was there, but the standard started to approach what eventually turned into quantitization. Once that ran its course, the obsession then became humanization. Bottom line: it is what it is. Anyway, we're talking about pop music here. I don't mean this as a slight (I think), but this is lowest common denominator music, accessible by as many as possible and with 'guidance' from the top of the food chain, and therefore by definition severely limited. Unfortunately, we're all forced to hear it in supermarkets, restaurants, etc, yet I get the sense that many of you feel that pop music should be 'good' music and have the highest of production standards. Unless the general public decides to become educated consumers of music this will never happen, and I will add - I hope it doesn't. Sorry if I seem to be a snob about this, but I could care less about pop music. Let the production standards be what they are and what the market will afford. Sometimes, I hope the industry does die, what with some of the crappiest music enjoying the highest of production quality. Let's call it what it is - Most of the of the best music out there is decidedly not popular. I can write a pretty decent song, (better than most out there in my narcissistic world point of view - but I'll never make a penny with it, and I'm not sure that I should. You all lament the quality of the singers, players and songwriters that make it to the top, but I say the public is getting what it deserves. Be thankful you're not all poets. There! End of rant. I feel better now.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 6, 2015 7:23:49 GMT -6
How about Frank Sinatra! Incredible, warm, clear tone.
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Post by M57 on Dec 6, 2015 7:37:30 GMT -6
How about Frank Sinatra! Incredible, warm, clear tone. different era.. Most of his work, or at least his early work wasn't multi-tracked.. A robust industry catering to the few was a necessity. Sinatra is fine, but I'm more a fan of the phrasings of Sara Vaughn or Tony Bennett.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 6, 2015 8:22:50 GMT -6
How about Frank Sinatra! Incredible, warm, clear tone. different era.. Most of his work, or at least his early work wasn't multi-tracked.. A robust industry catering to the few was a necessity. Sinatra is fine, but I'm more a fan of the phrasings of Sara Vaughn or Tony Bennett. I guess Sinatra used an RCA 44 and U-47 back in the day. Yeah it was a different era but it's still the recording industry. Capitol Records. I've always loved Sinatra's style, Dean Martin and Sammy Davis Jr also come to mind as a couple of the greats. They were all heavy smokers too!
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Post by Guitar on Dec 6, 2015 8:47:24 GMT -6
That said its nothing compared to listening to a crowd of 400 plus sing some heartfelt lyrics you wrote along with you as you passionately play for them. Words can't express it. Rocinate what is this band called? I'd like to check it out. That's a fine accomplishment, I'd say.
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Post by jcoutu1 on Dec 6, 2015 9:52:06 GMT -6
That said its nothing compared to listening to a crowd of 400 plus sing some heartfelt lyrics you wrote along with you as you passionately play for them. Words can't express it. Rocinate what is this band called? I'd like to check it out. That's a fine accomplishment, I'd say. +1
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Post by rocinante on Dec 6, 2015 10:22:38 GMT -6
There was two my comrades. The first was my wifes band I jumped on just as they signed to a bigger label. It was called Apocalypse Theatre. They had a ton of transformations before and changed a ton after. In the middle somewhere I came in and left years later. During the metal years. My wife (and the growling metal vocalist) became a therapist who works with mostly urban youth and other members are my colleagues and partners in our pre post audio video company. We are all still very much friends even though theres been 40 plus members. The second is/was a gypsy punk band called sai u drom. www.saiudrom.com is a good way to listen and read. Such good times and great people who I am honored to have played on a stage with. All of them.
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Post by Bob Olhsson on Dec 6, 2015 11:39:10 GMT -6
At the same time Motown and the Beatles owned the top 10, Frank Sinatra was selling more records! That fact kept everybody's head straight.
Everybody owes phrasing, swing and rock and roll to Ella Fitzgerald and Louis Jordan singing and playing sax solos with the Chick Webb band.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 6, 2015 11:50:31 GMT -6
Sinatra was singing with the Tommy Dorsey orchestra in the early-mid 40's. His style never really changed from those early days. He got stronger if anything else.
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Post by chasmanian on Dec 6, 2015 15:29:49 GMT -6
I read Sinatra learned breath control from working with trombone player Tommy Dorsey.
from the wiki for Dorsey:
"Frank Sinatra achieved his first great success as a vocalist in the Dorsey band and claimed he learned breath control from watching Dorsey play trombone."
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Post by M57 on Dec 6, 2015 16:01:46 GMT -6
Apparently there are a lot of guest artists singing some of his standards. Should be entertainlng to hear some of them mangle the genre. Very few of the singers that sang duets with Tony Bennett while in his 80's could keep up with him. His phrasing was just stunning.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 6, 2015 19:06:00 GMT -6
I read Sinatra learned breath control from working with trombone player Tommy Dorsey. from the wiki for Dorsey: "Frank Sinatra achieved his first great success as a vocalist in the Dorsey band and claimed he learned breath control from watching Dorsey play trombone." Buddy Rich was in that same band, they say they were rivals and both wanted the spotlight.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 6, 2015 20:40:34 GMT -6
Seth MacFarlane just killed it! He sounded just like Frank in a couple spots.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,937
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Post by ericn on Dec 7, 2015 14:25:51 GMT -6
Seth MacFarlane just killed it! He sounded just like Frank in a couple spots. He was a pleasant surprise ! Enjoyed Gaga as well , they seamed "get it " rather than just " sing it"! Often the hardest part when a singer covers something that everybody has stamped in their brain, is getting the feel right and not the performance, most of us don't know the notes , but we know the feel!
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Post by Guitar on Dec 7, 2015 14:55:40 GMT -6
There was two my comrades. The first was my wifes band I jumped on just as they signed to a bigger label. It was called Apocalypse Theatre. They had a ton of transformations before and changed a ton after. In the middle somewhere I came in and left years later. During the metal years. My wife (and the growling metal vocalist) became a therapist who works with mostly urban youth and other members are my colleagues and partners in our pre post audio video company. We are all still very much friends even though theres been 40 plus members. The second is/was a gypsy punk band called sai u drom. www.saiudrom.com is a good way to listen and read. Such good times and great people who I am honored to have played on a stage with. All of them. Top notch material. Thanks for posting.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 7, 2015 15:35:05 GMT -6
Seth MacFarlane just killed it! He sounded just like Frank in a couple spots. He was a pleasant surprise ! Enjoyed Gaga as well , they seamed "get it " rather than just " sing it"! Often the hardest part when a singer covers something that everybody has stamped in their brain, is getting the feel right and not the performance, most of us don't know the notes , but we know the feel! Gaga was pretty good, she coulda held that last note a little longer though Connick had a nice tone but lacked power, Macfarlane is just a monster, that guy can sing!
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Post by schmalzy on Dec 8, 2015 16:52:07 GMT -6
If you're complaining about the sound and feel of modern music, it's because you're not looking in the right places.
There are so many really, truly talented bands out doing it with as much love and hard work as ever in history. They're just further buried by "the industry" than they ever were.
Just in the independent rock category:
Luther:
Hop Along:
Into It. Over It.:
Cool songs from people who care and are as practiced as anyone in popular rock music history. Less "party" and more introspection in the lyrics than in the past but that's the generation that grew up watching "Behind The Music."
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Post by M57 on Dec 8, 2015 16:52:03 GMT -6
Gaga was pretty good, she coulda held that last note a little longer though Connick had a nice tone but lacked power, Macfarlane is just a monster, that guy can sing! Connic was disappointing. I expected more and I agree that his voice lacked power and depth. I wonder that he was a bit under the weather. Macfarlane was tops; Gaga was good. There were some others with decent voices that otherwise ruined it with their contemporary melisma's/licks, which were completely out of touch with the genre. It was cool listening to the original arrangements by Riddle and others.
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Post by mobeach on Dec 8, 2015 17:07:26 GMT -6
Gaga was pretty good, she coulda held that last note a little longer though Connick had a nice tone but lacked power, Macfarlane is just a monster, that guy can sing! Connic was disappointing. I expected more and I agree that his voice lacked power and depth. I wonder that he was a bit under the weather. Macfarlane was tops; Gaga was good. There were some others with decent voices that otherwise ruined it with their contemporary melisma's/licks, which were completely out of touch with the genre. It was cool listening to the original arrangements by Riddle and others. It looked like Zac Brown had a hard time hitting some of those "Frank" notes. He covered my favorite Sinatra song.
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ericn
Temp
Balance Engineer
Posts: 14,937
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Post by ericn on Dec 8, 2015 17:56:31 GMT -6
If you're complaining about the sound and feel of modern music, it's because you're not looking in the right places. There are so many really, truly talented bands out doing it with as much love and hard work as ever in history. They're just further buried by "the industry" than they ever were. Just in the independent rock category: Luther: Hop Along: Into It. Over It.: Cool songs from people who care and are as practiced as anyone in popular rock music history. Less "party" and more introspection in the lyrics than in the past but that's the generation that grew up watching "Behind The Music." Part of the problem is there is so much talent out there, radio was our filter for years, now we have a couple of "experts " who decide what we hear and well they suck!
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Post by swurveman on Dec 9, 2015 14:41:57 GMT -6
Cool songs from people who care and are as practiced as anyone in popular rock music history. Less "party" and more introspection in the lyrics than in the past but that's the generation that grew up watching "Behind The Music." I don't mind the music you posted, but being "practiced" and being talented are two different things. I don't hear anything musically in these tracks from the guitar players that comes close to what Jimmy Page, Pete Townshend, Richards/Taylor, Walsh/Felder, The Edge, etc. did. I guess if "rock history" started with Green Day you'd have an argument. Thankfully, it didn't.
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Post by donr on Dec 9, 2015 15:41:48 GMT -6
When I was starting out, 'tight' was "Friday On My Mind" by the Easybeats, and "Talk Talk" by the Music Machine.
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Post by schmalzy on Dec 9, 2015 16:42:22 GMT -6
Cool songs from people who care and are as practiced as anyone in popular rock music history. Less "party" and more introspection in the lyrics than in the past but that's the generation that grew up watching "Behind The Music." I don't mind the music you posted, but being "practiced" and being talented are two different things. I don't hear anything musically in these tracks from the guitar players that comes close to what Jimmy Page, Pete Townshend, Richards/Taylor, Walsh/Felder, The Edge, etc. did. I guess if "rock history" started with Green Day you'd have an argument. Thankfully, it didn't. I didn't realize the measurement of talent was the amount of soloing done in the songs. I used to drill my guitar a legit 8 hours a day and could nail Jimmy Page, Angus Young, Kirk Hammet, John Petrucci, some Joe Satriani, and a bit of Steve Vai stuff. Then I tried to write songs. Writing a good song was way harder. Maybe what you're missing is the guitar player stepping on the light box and soloing over fogs and strobe lights. I guess I'm just more interested in the song as a whole than the guitar parts. If you'd like, I can find some more interesting guitar-related songs. In fact, here's two quick songs with the singer/guitarist from Into It. Over It. playing bass. One was recorded on to tape with two other songs over the course of a weekend and the other is a live track so you can see another song like it happening live: Way more interesting, imaginative, and original than minor pentatonic guitar solos. If you dig even slightly into the indie rock world you'll find a lot of guitar trickery, fingerpickery, and drum slickery. Many bands are just not motivated to put it out front and center these days.
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Post by lpedrum on Dec 9, 2015 16:44:42 GMT -6
Cool songs from people who care and are as practiced as anyone in popular rock music history. Less "party" and more introspection in the lyrics than in the past but that's the generation that grew up watching "Behind The Music." I don't mind the music you posted, but being "practiced" and being talented are two different things. I don't hear anything musically in these tracks from the guitar players that comes close to what Jimmy Page, Pete Townshend, Richards/Taylor, Walsh/Felder, The Edge, etc. did. I guess if "rock history" started with Green Day you'd have an argument. Thankfully, it didn't. I sort of agree. But I think we have to come to grips that the latter half of the 20th century was a golden age for music for a multitude of reasons. The post war world got smaller, technology exploded with records, radio, and multi track recording, new instruments were invented, music was no longer segregated, and youth rebelled against the conservative status quo. As a result we had Dylan, The Beatles, Marvin Gaye, The Who, Aretha, and on an on. It was an historically unique time, and on some level it's just not fair to hold new acts to that standard. Still, in the vids posted I would have loved to hear at least a bit of originality.
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