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Post by Johnkenn on Aug 7, 2013 7:03:56 GMT -6
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Post by henge on Aug 7, 2013 7:55:03 GMT -6
Thanks John! Great vid.
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Post by wreck on Aug 7, 2013 8:45:21 GMT -6
This vid almost inspired me to get a beta 91. I still want one. Already love the capi stuff, so task complete on that front.
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Post by tonycamphd on Aug 7, 2013 12:22:29 GMT -6
I bet when Jeff and Scott are in the same room alone together, they engage in telepathic communication, not a word spoken! lol! I'd bet you can almost hear the sound of hyper synapse brain function in the room lol!
Oh btw, the VP's//red dots are awesome!
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Post by svart on Aug 7, 2013 12:38:01 GMT -6
Yeah I'm digging the VP28. It just has a thicker sound.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2013 12:39:07 GMT -6
Watched it, didn't get much about the preamps. I'd need some shootout files for that but holy fuck what a good drummer. Interesting that the Toms don't kill the drum sound like my recordings. Mute the tom mics and shit sounds great, bring them in and they sound so terrible. I use MD421s in case anyone is wondering.
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Post by tonycamphd on Aug 7, 2013 12:59:23 GMT -6
Watched it, didn't get much about the preamps. I'd need some shootout files for that but holy fuck what a good drummer. Interesting that the Toms don't kill the drum sound like my recordings. Mute the tom mics and shit sounds great, bring them in and they sound so terrible. I use MD421s in case anyone is wondering. are you gating the tom mics? also, IMO, 95% of the drum sound comes from overheads, you should just bring the close tom mics up to touch and reinforce, and pan them to match the toms in the overheads. Aso, forget shoot outs, they're always "file" compromised, just get the vp28 and thank anyone who suggested it later 8) |
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Post by matt on Aug 7, 2013 12:59:25 GMT -6
Gotta pile on: great drumming! I need to get me one of these, badly. I am a craptastic programmer, and it's impossible to get the sound/feel of live drums. Then there's the CAPI stuff - sounds damn good!
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Post by svart on Aug 7, 2013 13:39:30 GMT -6
Watched it, didn't get much about the preamps. I'd need some shootout files for that but holy fuck what a good drummer. Interesting that the Toms don't kill the drum sound like my recordings. Mute the tom mics and shit sounds great, bring them in and they sound so terrible. I use MD421s in case anyone is wondering. I find this interesting. How does it sound terrible? That might be the clue.. I tend to use the overheads for the "definition" of the drum kit, and the close mics for the meat and decay of the kit. I don't agree that the overheads make up 90-95% of the kit sound, I think they should be a part of the drum sound as a whole. I think pulling up overheads and then trying to match the close mics is like mixing while soloing instruments! If you hear the overheads and close mics alone on "pro" mixes, they tend to sound like crap solo'd. This is because the mics have overlapping frequency ranges which when mixed cause some frequencies to double, some to null, etc. I tend to pull a lot of mids and low mids from the tom mics and just use the bottom end and some attack-ish high mids. For overheads I usually low cut from about 1K down at about -6db or so to get rid of a lot of the room boom that would normally screw with the tom sound. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2013 14:03:40 GMT -6
svart tonycamphdIt's very difficult to take this approach in the styles I work in. I do really up front and modern stuff. I need the close mics to be front and center. OHs are usually HP at 300hz. The tom mics just don't flatter the snare at all, the RT always picks up a papery smack of the snare, the FT isn't as bad but everything tightens up when both mics are strip silenced. I think Svart and I might have a similar style. You can hear some recent work at www.cautionhc.com I just got a call from the local tech. He's $50 an hour and while that is expensive I'll learn how to build the modules instead of having them built and he seems like a real upbeat guy and says I'll have a lot of fun with the project. I'll start in September. It is going to be a very big project but I'm leaning towards the VP26s. The site says the EA2623 is out of stock until August 23rd. I think I'm going to go with 4 of them being Red Dot (OH, Room etc) and 4 being Blue dot (close mics). I think this will give me the options I need regarding drum tracking. I go back to work in a month or so and should be able to get my order in and get into the shop. BEER LEAGUE HOCKEY STARTS SOON TOO SO I WILL TURN INTO AN INSUFFERABLE PRICK EVERY DAY THE LEAFS DON'T WIN AND A MANIACAL CLOWN EVERY TIME MY BEER LEAGUE TEAM LOSES.
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Post by jsteiger on Aug 7, 2013 19:04:24 GMT -6
I bet when Jeff and Scott are in the same room alone together, they engage in telepathic communication, not a word spoken! lol! I'd bet you can almost hear the sound of hyper synapse brain function in the room lol! Of course. Isn't that how all gear-nerdy-geeks communicate? We are just a couple of dorks hanging with a great drummer. BTW, I am the fat dork! This vid did inspire me to drop a few lbs. I do have wav files for these comparisons. I need to get them on my site for downloads. The youtube audio is less than a good way to really "hear" WTF is going on. I must add, the room is not a super great one. Concrete floor, parallel drywalled walls with some Aurelex here and there. Scott and I were worried when we first walked in. I learned once again that a great drummer on a well tuned kit trumps everything else. Ben is a monster. He laid way back to let things breathe for the goal of this video but man can he play. |
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Post by jsteiger on Aug 7, 2013 22:38:03 GMT -6
This thread lit a fire under my butt to get the page done so I can post video's and have audio clips to download at my site. So, check it out. I have the raw .wav file zips of the Ben Sesar session from the above posted youtube vid. classicapi.com/catalog/Audio_video_clips.php |
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Post by gouge on Aug 7, 2013 22:47:57 GMT -6
that's great jeff!!
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Post by svart on Aug 8, 2013 7:11:10 GMT -6
It's very difficult to take this approach in the styles I work in. I do really up front and modern stuff. I need the close mics to be front and center. OHs are usually HP at 300hz. The tom mics just don't flatter the snare at all, the RT always picks up a papery smack of the snare, the FT isn't as bad but everything tightens up when both mics are strip silenced. I think Svart and I might have a similar style. You can hear some recent work at www.cautionhc.com It sounds like it. I can put some drum stuff up tomorrow. It's mostly tracked with CAPI 312s but the overheads are Neve for that high end shimmer. The one thing I don't do is compress the toms on their own, I'll send them to the drum parallel compressor bus. I tend to gate or edit the track so it's only the drum hit and a portion of the tail. It sounds very short and abrupt when solo'd but in the mix you can't tell due to the overheads filling in. The mics are also very tight hyper-cardioid mics that I try to shield from the snare and cymbals by positioning. After all that, I just use EQ to carve out the boom and midrange that will fight in the mix. |
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Post by drumrec on Aug 8, 2013 8:52:42 GMT -6
This thread lit a fire under my butt to get the page done so I can post video's and have audio clips to download at my site. So, check it out. I have the raw .wav file zips of the Ben Sesar session from the above posted youtube vid. classicapi.com/catalog/Audio_video_clips.phpInspiring video and it does not get worse with a really good drummer  My next step will be two-stage VP28's, lovely! Thanks 4 clip |
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Post by watchtower on Aug 8, 2013 18:50:08 GMT -6
The Kick sounds a lot bigger through the dual stage pres. Did the mic move at all or maybe the level is up compared to the single stage? Great sounding drums and pres! Maybe I need to build me some CAPIs
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Post by tonycamphd on Aug 8, 2013 19:02:42 GMT -6
The Kick sounds a lot bigger through the dual stage pres. Did the mic move at all or maybe the level is up compared to the single stage? Great sounding drums and pres! Maybe I need to build me some CAPIs welcome to the forum watchtower! yeah, the vp28's are quite the versatile treat. |
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Post by jsteiger on Aug 8, 2013 19:21:21 GMT -6
The Kick sounds a lot bigger through the dual stage pres. Did the mic move at all or maybe the level is up compared to the single stage? Great sounding drums and pres! Maybe I need to build me some CAPIs Well, the kick mic definitely was not moved from one take to the other. The levels could be a littel different since we had the fully variable output t-pad on the single stage pre's. Once we installed the VP28's we tried to get the levels as close as we could given the slight restrictions of the fully stepped controls. I think the stepped controls are great but that did make it a little hard to replicate the VP26 level. I suppose one could import both kick wav files and see how close they are level wise. |
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Post by watchtower on Aug 8, 2013 19:27:56 GMT -6
The Kick sounds a lot bigger through the dual stage pres. Did the mic move at all or maybe the level is up compared to the single stage? Great sounding drums and pres! Maybe I need to build me some CAPIs Well, the kick mic definitely was not moved from one take to the other. The levels could be a littel different since we had the fully variable output t-pad on the single stage pre's. Once we installed the VP28's we tried to get the levels as close as we could given the slight restrictions of the fully stepped controls. I think the stepped controls are great but that did make it a little hard to replicate the VP26 level. I suppose one could import both kick wav files and see how close they are level wise. That would be interesting to see how they compare. Are the files available for download? It's not a huge deal, of course. |
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Post by tonycamphd on Aug 8, 2013 19:33:58 GMT -6
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2013 19:41:54 GMT -6
svart tonycamphdIt's very difficult to take this approach in the styles I work in. I do really up front and modern stuff. I need the close mics to be front and center. OHs are usually HP at 300hz. The tom mics just don't flatter the snare at all, the RT always picks up a papery smack of the snare, the FT isn't as bad but everything tightens up when both mics are strip silenced. I think Svart and I might have a similar style. You can hear some recent work at www.cautionhc.com I just got a call from the local tech. He's $50 an hour and while that is expensive I'll learn how to build the modules instead of having them built and he seems like a real upbeat guy and says I'll have a lot of fun with the project. I'll start in September. It is going to be a very big project but I'm leaning towards the VP26s. The site says the EA2623 is out of stock until August 23rd. I think I'm going to go with 4 of them being Red Dot (OH, Room etc) and 4 being Blue dot (close mics). I think this will give me the options I need regarding drum tracking. I go back to work in a month or so and should be able to get my order in and get into the shop. BEER LEAGUE HOCKEY STARTS SOON TOO SO I WILL TURN INTO AN INSUFFERABLE PRICK EVERY DAY THE LEAFS DON'T WIN AND A MANIACAL CLOWN EVERY TIME MY BEER LEAGUE TEAM LOSES. The modules couldn't be easier to build. I'd never soldered anything before in my life, and started with the VP26. now I have two 51x racks full of VP312s, VC528s, LC53A's, Serpent Audio SB4001s, ez1073-500's, Igor 51x-F76's and LAZ LA3A-500's, all built by myself from kits!! The vp26 takes about 3 hours to build. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2013 19:44:01 GMT -6
I'm curious why a better set of converters weren't used. The presonus board doesn't sound that great, compared to some AVID 192s, Apogee Symphony, etc.. Any ideas? It's a shame putting those creamy drums through a dirty window screen on the way to the computer, especially when doing a showcase like this.
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Post by sozocaps on Aug 8, 2013 20:01:49 GMT -6
Did you hear the apogee clips on Jeff's site? much better then the presonus board converters! Got rid of the digital sound and I was listening to the preamp and music.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2013 20:12:50 GMT -6
Oh man I was seriously hoping the Presonus conversion wouldn't be brought up. It's not a huge deal.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2013 20:15:09 GMT -6
svart tonycamphdIt's very difficult to take this approach in the styles I work in. I do really up front and modern stuff. I need the close mics to be front and center. OHs are usually HP at 300hz. The tom mics just don't flatter the snare at all, the RT always picks up a papery smack of the snare, the FT isn't as bad but everything tightens up when both mics are strip silenced. I think Svart and I might have a similar style. You can hear some recent work at www.cautionhc.com I just got a call from the local tech. He's $50 an hour and while that is expensive I'll learn how to build the modules instead of having them built and he seems like a real upbeat guy and says I'll have a lot of fun with the project. I'll start in September. It is going to be a very big project but I'm leaning towards the VP26s. The site says the EA2623 is out of stock until August 23rd. I think I'm going to go with 4 of them being Red Dot (OH, Room etc) and 4 being Blue dot (close mics). I think this will give me the options I need regarding drum tracking. I go back to work in a month or so and should be able to get my order in and get into the shop. BEER LEAGUE HOCKEY STARTS SOON TOO SO I WILL TURN INTO AN INSUFFERABLE PRICK EVERY DAY THE LEAFS DON'T WIN AND A MANIACAL CLOWN EVERY TIME MY BEER LEAGUE TEAM LOSES. The modules couldn't be easier to build. I'd never soldered anything before in my life, and started with the VP26. now I have two 51x racks full of VP312s, VC528s, LC53A's, Serpent Audio SB4001s, ez1073-500's, Igor 51x-F76's and LAZ LA3A-500's, all built by myself from kits!! The vp26 takes about 3 hours to build. I'm still going to have the tech look over my shoulder for a bit. I've tried soldering before and always had a very difficult time dealing with it. I think it was cause I was using a cheap iron all the time and it always took forever to even melt the solder. |
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My next step will be two-stage VP28's, lovely!
