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Post by Ward on Nov 3, 2019 6:44:20 GMT -6
Who else suffers from this? What kind of limitations does it put on your work? Does anyone have any solutions? Approximately what frequency range are your ears constantly ringing in?
It’s really getting to me.
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Post by stormymondays on Nov 3, 2019 7:05:47 GMT -6
Quick reply - I do have a mild case on a low frequency, which is a bit more rare. I was convinced I was hearing trucks on the street at night, until I heard them inside the soundproofed room. The best you can do about it is to not think about it, not measure it, not pay attention to it. The brain can get very good at ignoring a constant stimulus. There are some "retraining" therapy programs that do this, I forget their names. Once I started to acknowledge and ignore the problem, it got a lot better. It's easier said than done depending on the case. Some people have success blaming it on an external object. i.e. if you don't get mad at the refrigerator every time you notice its noise, just think that there's one in the room and there's nothing you can do about it.
Sorry to be so brief!
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Post by Ward on Nov 3, 2019 7:24:29 GMT -6
Quick reply - I do have a mild case on a low frequency, which is a bit more rare. I was convinced I was hearing trucks on the street at night, until I heard them inside the soundproofed room. The best you can do about it is to not think about it, not measure it, not pay attention to it. The brain can get very good at ignoring a constant stimulus. There are some "retraining" therapy programs that do this, I forget their names. Once I started to acknowledge and ignore the problem, it got a lot better. It's easier said than done depending on the case. Some people have success blaming it on an external object. i.e. if you don't get mad at the refrigerator every time you notice its noise, just think that there's one in the room and there's nothing you can do about it. Sorry to be so brief! Many thanks for your thoughtful reply!
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Post by drsax on Nov 3, 2019 9:20:12 GMT -6
Ward - hang in there brother. Pretty much what stormymondays said. I’ve had pretty severe tinnitus my entire career, accompanied by hyperacusis and hearing loss. Constant ringing around 6-8k, crackling, and pretty severe high frequency hearing loss in my left ear, and some hearing loss in my right ear as well. Tried all different kinds of medicine and natural remedies and nothing has helped. It’s all due to ruptured eardrums in college marching band from a trombonist behind me in formation who took pride in playing too loud. Literally ruptured both of my ear drums. Blood came out of both my ears... totally out of my control. Here’s the good news: When I don’t focus on it, It doesn’t bother me so much anymore. Although I will never experience true silence ever again, focusing on it makes it much worse. In spite of it all, God has blessed me to have a very successful career mixing, mastering, recording and playing. I think that tinnitus will only hold us back if we let it. One thing I have done is to ALWAYS have hearing protection on me. For me I just use the hearos foam shooting plugs. They are more comfortable for long periods of time than even my custom molds. If I’m anywhere loud, like a restaurant, or on stage, or loud studio session, etc... my earplugs are in. I cannot risk further damage. It took a while to get used to but 20 years of doing this and it’s just a normal part of life for me now. Be encouraged my friend. All of my best work of my career has happened with tinnitus. Try to not let it overwhelm you.
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Post by drsax on Nov 3, 2019 9:35:55 GMT -6
Ward - One more thing: Sound is subjective. And our frame of reference for frequencies is based on what WE hear. So the best way I’ve found to keep my frame of reference healthy is to constantly listen to the work of the best mix/mastering engineers in the world and compare my work to it frequency wise - ie. the amount of highs and lows, and overall sonic footprint. That gives me a healthy reference I know is valid. As long as I know what a great mix sounds like, I can achieve it. As my hearing changes, I must be tuned into what quality sounds like. If I isolate myself and trust only in myself, I risk being limited by my handicapped ears. External reference is my friend
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Post by christopher on Nov 3, 2019 9:51:47 GMT -6
Excellent advice on here! I feel the same, the more I ignore it, the less I notice it. I love mixing but it often triggers my ears even after only 30 minutes, esp NS10s. Unprocessed tracks are so dynamic, the peaks beat my ears up until I can get the dynamics under control, but then my ears are already sore.
Recently I discovered a solution though! I’m really excited about it: mix at really low levels. I started doing this just so I could work at home while my family is sleeping. So you can imagine how quiet that is, very very low levels. The washing machine is louder. I can work many hours this way and zero fatigue, zero tinnitus. Now I only work this way during the day too. I use references very often so that I keep the lows in check and my ears calibrated. It’s working incredibly well and I am extremely happy so far. I don’t think I could do this with clients around though, since they usually want it concert level. But for me on my own, this has been tremendously wonderful for my tinnitus.
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Post by svart on Nov 3, 2019 9:52:56 GMT -6
I do. My right ear.
A few years ago I had to go to a funeral and I got a severe head cold or sinus infection the day before I needed to get on a plane.
I thought that meds would help with the pressure, but they did not and the pressure change almost popped my eardrum.
I couldn't hear out of that ear for a week or so and ever since I can only barely detect above 10k in that ear, the rest is just a singing hiss and that ear is highly sensitive to mid-range distortion which becomes unbearable at some point where the other ear doesn't hear the problem.
Nothing really helps but I do use earplugs now while doing anything that's above a talking volume and that has helped me feel like I have regained some sensitivity. I avoid things that might trigger the midrange issue too, because the ear can ring for hours afterwards.
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Post by mike on Nov 3, 2019 9:58:51 GMT -6
Quick reply - I do have a mild case on a low frequency, which is a bit more rare. I was convinced I was hearing trucks on the street at night, until I heard them inside the soundproofed room. The best you can do about it is to not think about it, not measure it, not pay attention to it. The brain can get very good at ignoring a constant stimulus. There are some "retraining" therapy programs that do this, I forget their names. Once I started to acknowledge and ignore the problem, it got a lot better. It's easier said than done depending on the case. Some people have success blaming it on an external object. i.e. if you don't get mad at the refrigerator every time you notice its noise, just think that there's one in the room and there's nothing you can do about it. Sorry to be so brief! I once had a similar experience in the low frequency and was also convinced I was hearing trucks/semi's off in the distance constantly to the point I got in the car at 2 in the morning to try and figure out why heavy trucks would be working within a half mile of me at 2am and found nothing. I began to realize I had been going through a period of time on a project where I had been monitoring at too high a level for too long consistently. The solution for me didn't go away overnight, but after reducing my monitoring/mixing levels and taking a break from projects altogether for awhile led to it all going away and a return to normal hearing for me. Good luck Ward!
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Post by Mister Chase on Nov 3, 2019 10:53:36 GMT -6
I've had tinnitus for many years. I marched snare drum in marching band and in drum corps international. 12+ hr rehearsal days and no plugs in. So I have some pretty good dips in my hearing. Borderline normal hearing though. Oddly, the doc shows a consistent worse left ear than the right, in low freq and then high freq. They think that is a bit odd but who knows why. So if I play a sine wave through a mono speaker and turn my head from left to right, I actually hear two different pitches by a little bit. This is what happens with bilateral hearing loss affecting each ear differently.
Then a couple of years ago I started experiencing very severe bouts of sudden tinnitus and diminished hearing that followed lasting days sometimes. The doc cannot figure this out(and she is a D.C. area doc that is held in high esteem). Luckily the hearing has come back so far. But I may be driving or walking in the store or just sitting on the couch and bam, I can hardly hear out of one ear, usually the left, and the ringing is quite loud. Sometimes for a minute, sometimes days. On top of that, my left ear has some sort of fluttering reaction to all sound. If I am listening to mixes or something on phones at any moderate volume, I can hear and feel that left ear recoiling with the levels of sound. Odd.
Anyway, I tend not to think about it too much. There are plenty of pro engineers with ear issues. In fact, probably more than the normal population for obvious reasons.
It sucks though, and we are all with you on it. It can be infuriating when my hearing issues interfere with stereo balancing etc but... I'll keep doing it until I can't or the shot comes out to bring my hearing back. Best of luck.
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Post by Ward on Nov 3, 2019 12:50:24 GMT -6
Thanks people!!
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Post by ragan on Nov 3, 2019 13:08:54 GMT -6
I have it. Left ear. Very high pitched (18-20kHz) ringing for the last 10 years or so. That ear also distorts with brash stuff once it's past a certain volume.
I tried things like acupuncture and various supplements for a few years. Nothing had any affect on the tinnitus. One doc had an MRI done to rule out brain stuff. It bummed me out heavily for the first couple years. I'm just used to it now. I still have pretty good hearing, though that left ear does start to roll off above 12kHz or so.
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Post by jampa on Nov 3, 2019 14:50:01 GMT -6
I have the ringing type, mainly in my left ear. Main limitation I find is when I get my ears tested. The test tones get lost in the ringing. In any case I have mild hearing loss too.
It bothered me a lot when I was younger, but these days I can go weeks without noticing it. I agree with others, focusing on it makes it worse, which is an impossible situation right? But I don't find it affects my work too much. If anything, I am more careful and take more breaks. I also always have earplugs in my jacket pocket.
I'd like to add that reading these responses has been helpful so thanks everyone.
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Post by nudwig on Nov 3, 2019 15:45:52 GMT -6
There's these pills called Lipo Flavonoid (Rite Aid has a generic version called Ear Care that's the same thing) that help me out. I forget they're helping until I run out and I notice the ringing again after a day or two.
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Post by Mister Chase on Nov 3, 2019 15:51:41 GMT -6
There's these pills called Lipo Flavonoid (Rite Aid has a generic version called Ear Care that's the same thing) that help me out. I forget they're helping until I run out and I notice the ringing again after a day or two. That is true. I haven't tried it because of my prescription meds combining with it make for bleeding risk, but my last ENT who was a bass player recommended it to me.
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Post by wiz on Nov 3, 2019 17:00:51 GMT -6
I have it, it doesn't sound like one ear, more in the middle of my head.
Pretty high freq wise....
cheers
Wiz
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Post by Blackdawg on Nov 3, 2019 19:15:00 GMT -6
This thread is interesting to me. Good to see people dealing with it in a positive way.
Im curious what most people think caused their's? Saw Svarts story, that sucks man..but others? You all just mixing to loud? In bands a lot?
Im really cautious with my ears and thankfully don't have this issue, yet. I know my ears hear differently through ear training but that isn't so bad. I carry ear plugs with me at all times and use the for everything. Even washing the truck with a power washer for instance. I rarely go to to live shows anymore due to the loudness. And even when I do to support friends I wear ear plugs the entire time.
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Post by Mister Chase on Nov 3, 2019 19:17:39 GMT -6
There are so many good earplugs now like Etymotics etc that don't totally ruin the sound that there's not much excuse not to use them.
I used to play kit hours and hours a day starting at age 12, blasting the cd player through phones. Marching snare - been around some firearms without ear protection. Worked in a machine shop without ear protection. Lots of things over the years have contributed but I am actually kind of lucky that my dips aren't into the hearing loss zone considering.
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Post by mulmany on Nov 3, 2019 19:32:15 GMT -6
I have it... Have had it since I was a kid. I had lots of really bad ear infections from spending all summer swimming.
It use to be periodic, and I would only notice it at night when it was really quiet.
I then started playing bass in bands, standing right up on the snare side of the drummer. Unfortunately I was not smart enough to wear ear plugs until more damage was done. After starting in studio work, I have been really careful. Don't drive with the windows down, use ear plugs on long drives, leave if a concert is to loud even with plugs in. Some times its a real drag, but some how I can still record, mix, and do live sound gigs.
I now have a 2.8k and octave ringing. It settles down sometimes and is really loud other times. While typing this, it's probably 40dB continuous. I have pondered how much I could handle before it drives me nuts. To compound it I have vertigo which is induced primarily by sound pressure levels and head colds.
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Post by donr on Nov 3, 2019 19:35:18 GMT -6
My ears ring all the time. Playing electric guitar in a rock band since 1965 and still doing it. I figured out where the ringing freq is, for me it's 5230 Hz. I tune it out mentally most of the time, but any exposure to loud noise will make the ringing more apparent. I generally carry Heroes in my pocket like drsax.
I can still hear and enjoy music, but the tinnitus has masked sensitivity to low level high frequencies. Doing recording recently, I was surprised at how low level the engineers were monitoring the audio. I'd need some more volume to trust what I was hearing.
Sleeping, I generally have some electric fan noise, or surf playing on my phone, to smooth the ringing in my head.
Overall, my hearing loss subjectively seems no worse than average for people my age. Most people haven't been exposed to the loudness I have either. A cure for tinnitus would be awesome though.
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Post by teejay on Nov 3, 2019 20:35:19 GMT -6
I don't have the live band experience or years of mixing a lot of you do, but did listen to music pretty loudly in headphones when I was younger. I'm getting older too. I don't have it constantly, but do have versions of it in both ears. Left is a flutter or distortion when certain frequencies are present for a period of time. Once it starts even someone talking can make it persist. It's so distracting that I just have to disengage from the environment. Right ear is the pulsatile tinnitus (whooshing sound to the beat of my heart) and is present every morning when I wake up. Usually disappears by mid-day. Also some difficulty hearing clearly at times on the right side...often have to have my wife repeat what she said if she's on that side. Pretty sure I've lost some vocal intelligibility frequencies on that side. Talked to my primary doc about it (he's a lot younger than me) and he told me he has it too...nothing can be done. May have to try that Lipo Flavonoid.
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Post by Mister Chase on Nov 3, 2019 20:43:46 GMT -6
Just keep hope and know that work is being done in the area of sensorineural hearing loss due to loss of the cilia in the cochlea. They started human trials of an injection that was shown to regrow the cilia in animal testing.
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Post by indiehouse on Nov 4, 2019 9:21:01 GMT -6
Man, it's such a comfort to read all of this. I have it. I was stupid when I was younger. Playing in bands really did a number. My buddies and I drove across the country with the windows down most of the time. I didn't think anything of it until later in life. I remember my hearing was muffled when we arrived. I went to a Lollapalooza headlined by Soundgarden and Metallica once. I stood right it front. I couldn't hear for two days after that. I thought it was a badge of honor at the time. Like bragging rights for how much I was rock and roll. Stupid. I took a flight to Europe once and the pressure really, really hurt my ears. I couldn't really hear for a few days after that. I don't go as many live shows as I used to. And I always wear Etymotics when I do. I am really aware these days to take care of my hearing. But loud noises will make it worse. Right now it's a pretty high hiss. I notice it most laying in bed at night. Sometimes I get these really loud tones in one ear or the other. Eventually fades. Not sure what that's about. Sometimes it's hard for me to concentrate on what other people are saying at loud and busy restaurants. Don't know if that's related or not.
The one thing that does my hearing in on an almost daily basis are my two little girls (age 2 and 7). They are so loud, and they squeal and scream (as kids do) sooo loud. Makes my ears ring every time. And sometimes they are screaming/squealing right in my ear. It's even louder when they do it during bath time. Seems louder in there.
Anyways, Tinnitus makes me depressed. I know it's only going to get worse as I get older.
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Post by teejay on Nov 4, 2019 10:36:44 GMT -6
The one thing that does my hearing in on an almost daily basis are my two little girls (age 2 and 7). They are so loud, and they squeal and scream (as kids do) sooo loud. Makes my ears ring every time. And sometimes they are screaming/squealing right in my ear. It's even louder when they do it during bath time. Seems louder in there. Double-edged sword right there. You don't want more damage or ringing, but those girls will grow up fast and one day the house will be dead quiet (and not from loss of hearing). Enjoy them while you can!
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Post by mcirish on Nov 4, 2019 10:48:01 GMT -6
I've had tinnitus growing worse for the last few years. The pitch is getting lower. I try to ignore it when I can. I also use references in mixes a lot more than I used to. I even double check things about 10k with meters, just to make sure nothing is getting crazy. I'm sure mine is mostly age related now but I'm sure that standing in front of a wall of amps in the 80's didn't help me at all. It's funny how back then I loved the felling of power that high powered amps and speakers gave. Now, I'm the first to reach for hearing protection. I always figure there isn't much need for deaf musicians and/or engineers. I need to save what I have. I have a couple brothers who are in to word working. The sound of a planer or router would make anyone deaf. They are living proof.
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Tinnitus
Nov 4, 2019 11:37:49 GMT -6
via mobile
Post by keymod on Nov 4, 2019 11:37:49 GMT -6
Mine's not a frequency, but more of a hiss. Like steam escaping from an old cast iron radiator. It's gotten more apparent over the years. I just try to ignore it.
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