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Post by guitfiddler on Sept 16, 2019 14:39:09 GMT -6
I just ordered a Hakko fx888D station. What kind/size tips do you recommend for doing CAPI kits? Conical/wedge...I know it’s a personal preference thing, but say for instance the longer/slimmer conical tips? Would this actually work better, or do you find the wedge work better?
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Post by mulmany on Sept 16, 2019 16:08:17 GMT -6
I end up using the standard tip for everything until I get to opamps. Then I size down the tip.
I have a bunch of tips that I bought just in case... They never get used.
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Post by mdmitch2 on Sept 17, 2019 14:04:31 GMT -6
I've tried them all, and I use the 1.6mm wedge tip for almost everything.
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Post by johneppstein on Sept 17, 2019 15:46:03 GMT -6
I have an excellent tip for the novice user of soldering irons.
Don't grab the wrong end.
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elcct
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Post by elcct on Sept 19, 2019 14:51:42 GMT -6
I'd say buy a pack of assorted tips and find the one that works best for you.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 11:13:37 GMT -6
I've tried them all, and I use the 1.6mm wedge tip for almost everything. Same here. Works great. Sometimes I think I'd like to have a smaller one for putting op amps together, but even then I get by just fine. |
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Post by Cyrus Melchor on Sept 23, 2019 5:08:12 GMT -6
I'm all about the chisel tips. Even for SMD parts. Just 2 sizes and I'm happy. Whatever you get, don't buy them no name knockoffs from ebay or amazon. Get official Hakko. 5 times the price or so but the bootlegs literally chip away and fall apart within days. The real ones don't. For years, seriously. You can order straight from American Hakko. And they'll take care of your and your machines. They made my 808 desoldering gun brand new again last year. The lone inconvenience was that I had to fax back the countersigned estimate. FAX! Haaa.
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Post by svart on Sept 23, 2019 14:24:28 GMT -6
Whatever you choose, get the hottest tips you can get. As a professional solderer, the worst thing you can do is use low-power tips and hold them on the PCB for long periods of time. If it takes more than 1/2 a second to melt any solder joint, you're using too little power.
What happens is that the longer you hold the iron to the through-hole or SMD pad, the more heat-soaking takes place. It's the heat soaking that can really cause a pad/trace/hole to come loose. Using a hot iron and working quickly will reduce the total heat-soaking although the localized heat will be higher. Even if a pad/trace/hole becomes hotter for a shorter period, the heat will dissipate quickly since the adjacent area is still cool.
Modern FR4 PCB material is really strong stuff. It takes quite a bit to destroy it, much more than you'll be able to do with a normal iron, so don't worry about it.
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elcct
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Post by elcct on Sept 25, 2019 5:33:57 GMT -6
How do you find the "hottest tips"? I thought usually you can see the shape / size of the tip as a parameter and not how quickly it can get hot? Unless I am missing something.
Also I set my station usually to like 400C so the tip has a constant temperature. The truth is however, the tip doesn't live long under these conditions. For example I took a new tip to solder gar2520 op amps and managed to solder about 15 before I had to replace it. I also don't have the station on of for long periods of time. I switch it off when I go look for a batch of parts.
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Post by Cyrus Melchor on Sept 25, 2019 5:39:30 GMT -6
How do you find the "hottest tips"? I thought usually you can see the shape / size of the tip as a parameter and not how quickly it can get hot? Unless I am missing something. Also I set my station usually to like 400C so the tip has a constant temperature. The truth is however, the tip doesn't live long under these conditions. For example I took a new tip to solder gar2520 op amps and managed to solder about 15 before I had to replace it. I also don't have the station on of for long periods of time. I switch it off when I go look for a batch of parts. That's what happened when I tried out the cheap no name tips. With the Hakko tips I keep my station on the whole day and have no problems. Maybe it's also the constant cooling and heating that's doing em in. |
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Post by svart on Sept 25, 2019 8:59:17 GMT -6
How do you find the "hottest tips"? I thought usually you can see the shape / size of the tip as a parameter and not how quickly it can get hot? Unless I am missing something. Also I set my station usually to like 400C so the tip has a constant temperature. The truth is however, the tip doesn't live long under these conditions. For example I took a new tip to solder gar2520 op amps and managed to solder about 15 before I had to replace it. I also don't have the station on of for long periods of time. I switch it off when I go look for a batch of parts. Usually the tips are rated for temperature. If not, then you're probably working with a lower end iron and all bets are off. However, there's still things you can do to force the tips to last longer.. The biggest issue with tip lifespan is that people use sponges with water and they wipe the tips off before putting them back in the holders. If you want the tips to last, do NEITHER of these things. Buy a dry tip cleaner and only wipe the tip right before you use it and always leave solder on it when you put it back in the holder, or if you're turning the iron off, use a lot of solder until there's a blob on the tip that covers it entirely and let the iron cool with that on it. They'll last a lot longer if you get into the habit of doing this. The tin plating on the tip is generally a lot thinner on cheaper iron tips which is why they wear out faster, but also because the metals at those temps tend to become more highly reactive with oxygen and it speeds oxidization which eats away at the thin tin coatings very quickly. This is why you always leave the solder on the tips when they're hot and when you let it cool. Also, I've seen a lot of people put pressure on the tips thinking it will help heat the joint more quickly. It won't. If you find yourself trying to "push" the tip into the solder to get it to heat faster, your iron isn't nearly hot enough and you're just scraping the tin coating off that much faster. Just set it on the joint and feed the solder into the gap with very little pressure. |
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Post by svart on Sept 25, 2019 9:03:11 GMT -6
How do you find the "hottest tips"? I thought usually you can see the shape / size of the tip as a parameter and not how quickly it can get hot? Unless I am missing something. Also I set my station usually to like 400C so the tip has a constant temperature. The truth is however, the tip doesn't live long under these conditions. For example I took a new tip to solder gar2520 op amps and managed to solder about 15 before I had to replace it. I also don't have the station on of for long periods of time. I switch it off when I go look for a batch of parts. That's what happened when I tried out the cheap no name tips. With the Hakko tips I keep my station on the whole day and have no problems. Maybe it's also the constant cooling and heating that's doing em in. Actually you want your iron to idle down in temperatures whenever it's not being used. My professional JBC iron does idle temps in the 250-300F range and high temps in the 800F range and the tips generally last a year or so with daily hard use. My Metacals will eat tips a bit faster because they don't idle, but they're still much more hardy than Haako or Wellers have ever been. Idling down the temps will get below the oxygen reactivity I mentioned above and the tips won't crust over with oxides that destroy the tin plating if they stay below a certain temperature for most of their lives. |
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Post by Cyrus Melchor on Sept 25, 2019 13:04:49 GMT -6
Idling down the temps will get below the oxygen reactivity I mentioned above and the tips won't crust over with oxides that destroy the tin plating if they stay below a certain temperature for most of their lives. Noted! Thanks for the explanation. |
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Post by guitfiddler on Sept 25, 2019 16:13:40 GMT -6
Thanks Svart for the info as well as others that have contributed to this thread. What temperature do you find works best for say a CAPI kit?
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Post by svart on Sept 26, 2019 8:57:41 GMT -6
Thanks Svart for the info as well as others that have contributed to this thread. What temperature do you find works best for say a CAPI kit? Most tips I use that have temp ratings are in the 700F-750F range. Use the largest tip you can comfortably use and it'll stay a more consistent temperature too. |
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Post by woofhead on Sept 26, 2019 9:40:41 GMT -6
Thanks Svart always great to learn some new tips! That dry cleaning of the tip makes so much sense can't believe Im just learning that now have a great day
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2019 19:46:32 GMT -6
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Post by tourtelot on Jul 6, 2020 10:03:07 GMT -6
I use the long conical tip for almost everything day-to-day. Sometimes, I forget that it makes a big difference to "size-up" to a fattie screwdriver tip when I have a bunch of XLRs to solder but almost always remember to go to a chisel tip if I'm pulling solder across surface-mount pads.
D.
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Post by johneppstein on Jul 6, 2020 11:51:53 GMT -6
HAH!
Obviously that iron isn't even on!
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Post by stratboy on Jul 12, 2020 7:53:30 GMT -6
Great info and insights. Thanks.
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