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Post by swurveman on Sept 7, 2019 7:46:35 GMT -6
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Post by swafford on Sept 7, 2019 8:15:11 GMT -6
I'm sort of partial to an astatic mic through a small amp that's cranked and mic'd. I use a blue bullet and either a Gibson BR6 or a Vintage 47 I used that quite a bit and sometimes double tracked it with a clean vocal and ride each one up and down depending on the verse. You can hear it here raw up till the 2nd to last verse where I switched to a Shure 55, if I recall. murdercreekassembly.bandcamp.com/track/roll-away-slowlythis one is double tracked and echoed in at various places for effect: murdercreekassembly.bandcamp.com/track/dave-long-aint-nobodyAlso the Shure SM5b is about the most gravely mic I've sung into. Take off the foam thingy, get right up on the element and use a pre that loves detail. Now that thing through an amp distorting would probably stellar...I might have to try that. You can hear it here on the first verse, the other versus are the SM7b. murdercreekassembly.bandcamp.com/track/sissys-lullaby
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Post by swurveman on Sept 7, 2019 9:15:57 GMT -6
I'm sort of partial to an astatic mic through a small amp that's cranked and mic'd. I use a blue bullet and either a Gibson BR6 or a Vintage 47 I used that quite a bit and sometimes double tracked it with a clean vocal and ride each one up and down depending on the verse. You can hear it here raw up till the 2nd to last verse where I switched to a Shure 55, if I recall. murdercreekassembly.bandcamp.com/track/roll-away-slowlythis one is double tracked and echoed in at various places for effect: murdercreekassembly.bandcamp.com/track/dave-long-aint-nobodyAlso the Shure SM5b is about the most gravely mic I've sung into. Take off the foam thingy, get right up on the element and use a pre that loves detail. Now that thing through an amp distorting would probably stellar...I might have to try that. You can hear it here on the first verse, the other versus are the SM7b. murdercreekassembly.bandcamp.com/track/sissys-lullabyThanks. I usually sing out of a SM58. Not sure if that's considered non gravelly, but my pitch is better when I play guitar while singing, so I use a dynamic mic instead of a LDC. I was surprised that your vocals didn't sound more distorted running them through an amp. The smallest amp cabinet I own a 2x12" with alnico blues. I'll try it out. Thanks!
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Post by chessparov on Sept 7, 2019 11:22:36 GMT -6
ART Tube MP Chris
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Post by mrholmes on Sept 7, 2019 11:32:44 GMT -6
Would try to pitch correct it in a range where you hear fewer artifacts... and give it some beef with a tube screamer...
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Post by johneppstein on Sept 7, 2019 11:36:33 GMT -6
Practice singing old Howlin' Wolf songs. Try to sound as authentic as possible. After a couple years it'll come.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Sept 7, 2019 11:56:16 GMT -6
Guitar amp. Split your signal after your preamp, send one to tape, send the other to a reamp box and into an amp.
Make sure you are hearing both the dry and the guitar amp feed in the cans and start messing around with the gain staging of the amp. You’ll find a sweet spot where the dynamics of your voice will do something really cool with the amp.
The real fun starts when you start throwing delay and overdrive pedals in front of the amp.
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Post by chessparov on Sept 7, 2019 12:30:11 GMT -6
A stock Oktava 319, will also add some weight to the voice-which helps this. Below is an acapella clip, where it adds 5+ years and 25 pounds! to my voice. FWIW out of all my vocal microphones, it's the best at getting me closer to a "Stephen Stills"/mild rasp type tone, like Stephen's 60's/70's vocal prime. Chris
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Post by viciousbliss on Sept 7, 2019 14:14:02 GMT -6
Samson MTR201 mic crunches nice. For plugins, CLAEffects has good distortion. Some 1176 plugins will add grit well. The delay and reverb fx are another factor. Certain hardware eq emulations. SSL stuff. I’ve found a few ways to kinda enhance whatever grit is there.
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Post by Blackdawg on Sept 7, 2019 15:24:01 GMT -6
Over drive an 1176 in parallel and mix to taste. Can also overdrive the 1176 into another tube style comp and also over drive it. Good distortion
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Post by swurveman on Sept 7, 2019 15:37:34 GMT -6
Over drive an 1176 in parallel and mix to taste. Can also overdrive the 1176 into another tube style comp and also over drive it. Good distortion Do you do it in the all buttons mode, or some other setting. How much compression? Are you pegging the parallel 1176?
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Post by Blackdawg on Sept 7, 2019 17:00:32 GMT -6
Over drive an 1176 in parallel and mix to taste. Can also overdrive the 1176 into another tube style comp and also over drive it. Good distortion Do you do it in the all buttons mode, or some other setting. How much compression? Are you pegging the parallel 1176? I like 20:1 but ABI is great too. Really the compression is secondary. I like 20:1 and just have the needle dancing a bit. It's the output you want to over drive. This is tricky to do with a daw and is a fundamental flaw if hardware inserts. On a console you'd over drive the output making the 1176 output distort. Then just turn down the fader. But in a daw your going to be slamming the converter too. So if you have a way to turn down the over driven signal before going back in that's best. Can use anything really with it's own gain stage. A CAPI ML2 would be perfect for this. You can also play with the attack and release to get an 1176 to distort beautifully. This is a great trick for bass.
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Post by schmalzy on Sept 8, 2019 13:12:44 GMT -6
When I need a bit of extra grit in someone's voice, I'm looking at parallel distortion and/or pitch effects. I work with a lot of heavy music so take that into consideration. Realness is not something I'm often striving for but I'm also doing my best to not sound synthetic
I think the busing is kind of important to making this work so I wanted to mention it.
In the DAW: Lead Vox, Pitched Lead Vox, and Vox Parallel all route into Vox+ group that goes to my master.
Lead Vox A gets the processing it requires to get a great sound. On heavy stuff it's often detail EQ -> shaping EQ -> Slow compressor -> limiter -> light saturation, de-essing if necessary.
Pitched Lead Vox gets a pitch effect like Lil' Alter Boy from Soundtoys. I pitch the note, the formant, or both down whatever amount doesn't feel weird. It's all a gut thing where it just feels like the original voice but different. On sung stuff, it's often an octave down for the note or the formant but sometimes it's the note down the octave and the formant down a fourth (or similar). It's going to sound wonky but that's OK. It just adds something when blended with the lead. I'm going for "don't hear it obviously but miss it when it's gone" style of subtlety on the blend with the full mix. If listening in solo, you hear it a little but not mixed as loud as a reinforcement/thickening double. Then it gets the rest of the Lead Vox A processing.
Both get routed to Vox Parallel.
Vox Parallel gets a Distressor (Kush's Deflector has been my fave) or Boz's +10db (because it feels aggressive) and an aggressive saturation or distortion box (UAD's Rat has been cool here if you are careful with the harsh are of the frequency spectrum). A tubescreamer might work better if you're aiming at more nuance. I think TSE has a good tubescreamer plugin that works great on vocals.
That's all bused to my Vox+ group. Low ratio leveling compression and Soothe (the order varies depending on the material) on the group to tie it all together. Oftentimes this compressor isn't doing much but, you know, it's helping hold it all together when things start to get a little stacked up or push higher dynamically. Soothe is often only dealing with extra esses the track de-essing didn't handle. When you start smashing stuff and doing parallel stuff some of those esses come back around to haunt you.
Good luck in your pursuit of gravel!
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Post by chessparov on Sept 8, 2019 16:02:32 GMT -6
(best Euell Gibbons voice) Ever "eat" a Green Bullet? Some parts are audible! Might be worth a try. Hmm... Green Bullet>Silver Bullet. Worth a shot too. Chris
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Post by Deleted on Sept 9, 2019 16:52:27 GMT -6
This: www.radialeng.com/product/extc-sa... and a distortion/overdrive pedal are your buddy here. I like using my Rat. The filter control is handy for this sorta thing. Soundtoys Decapitator is good too. Amp is also good. Not as streamlined though. Or just scream a lot, then sing.
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Post by chessparov on Sept 9, 2019 18:16:18 GMT -6
James Lugo and Kenny Tamplin can both teach "safe screaming" BTW. Chris
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Post by Vincent R. on Sept 9, 2019 19:00:17 GMT -6
Do some research on vocal fry and glottal compression.
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Post by chessparov on Sept 9, 2019 19:14:49 GMT -6
And you could record your vocals, sitting on a mechanical massage chair! Chris
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Post by svart on Sept 10, 2019 9:16:44 GMT -6
Over drive an 1176 in parallel and mix to taste. Can also overdrive the 1176 into another tube style comp and also over drive it. Good distortion I do this into a LA2A and I get all kinds of nice distortion if I use the 1176A pushing the input of the LA2A hard.
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Post by soundintheround on Sept 10, 2019 9:29:30 GMT -6
Over drive an 1176 in parallel and mix to taste. Can also overdrive the 1176 into another tube style comp and also over drive it. Good distortion I do this into a LA2A and I get all kinds of nice distortion if I use the 1176A pushing the input of the LA2A hard. The re-issues or originals?
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Post by svart on Sept 10, 2019 9:55:41 GMT -6
I do this into a LA2A and I get all kinds of nice distortion if I use the 1176A pushing the input of the LA2A hard. The re-issues or originals? Clones. Hairball rev A 1176 and Drip rev 1 LA2A.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2019 10:20:16 GMT -6
The re-issues or originals? Clones. Hairball rev A 1176 and Drip rev 1 LA2A. My MC77 with both 4 & 8:1 pushed in gives a pretty noticeable grind in the top end. Digging that. I bet it's even more extreme with the Rev A. I really need to build one of those. I use the UAD on the "nice distortion" preset with no GR in parallel on guitar solos sometimes. Sounds awesome.
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Post by svart on Sept 10, 2019 10:35:32 GMT -6
Clones. Hairball rev A 1176 and Drip rev 1 LA2A. My MC77 with both 4 & 8:1 pushed in gives a pretty noticeable grind in the top end. Digging that. I bet it's even more extreme with the Rev A. I really need to build one of those. I use the UAD on the "nice distortion" preset with no GR in parallel on guitar solos sometimes. Sounds awesome. The rev A has a very obvious distortion and compression when the volume is turned up, even when the sidechain compression is turned off/bypassed. The later revs had various amounts of success fixing this. It's a bit different sounding than the distortion that the compression itself creates. Kinda like the difference between preamp and power tube distortion in a guitar amp. Both cool and you can fine tune what you want.
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Post by soundintheround on Sept 10, 2019 10:48:16 GMT -6
My MC77 with both 4 & 8:1 pushed in gives a pretty noticeable grind in the top end. Digging that. I bet it's even more extreme with the Rev A. I really need to build one of those. I use the UAD on the "nice distortion" preset with no GR in parallel on guitar solos sometimes. Sounds awesome. The rev A has a very obvious distortion and compression when the volume is turned up, even when the sidechain compression is turned off/bypassed. The later revs had various amounts of success fixing this. It's a bit different sounding than the distortion that the compression itself creates. Kinda like the difference between preamp and power tube distortion in a guitar amp. Both cool and you can fine tune what you want. Getting some grit out of a hardware 1176, no matter what version, I don’t think is major news for anyone. But getting some grit out of an LA-2A, is a little more interesting to hear your approach there. I’ve only had my re-issue for a few months but haven’t tried that trick yet. Although I have tracked mono drums through an Ampex MX-10 direct into the LA-2A and maybe that’s why I loved it so much. It was adding some distortion possibly?
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Post by svart on Sept 10, 2019 10:56:43 GMT -6
The rev A has a very obvious distortion and compression when the volume is turned up, even when the sidechain compression is turned off/bypassed. The later revs had various amounts of success fixing this. It's a bit different sounding than the distortion that the compression itself creates. Kinda like the difference between preamp and power tube distortion in a guitar amp. Both cool and you can fine tune what you want. Getting some grit out of a hardware 1176, no matter what version, I don’t think is major news for anyone. But getting some grit out of an LA-2A, is a little more interesting to hear your approach there. I’ve only had my re-issue for a few months but haven’t tried that trick yet. Although I have tracked mono drums through an Ampex MX-10 direct into the LA-2A and maybe that’s why I loved it so much. It was adding some distortion possibly? It can add a noticable fuzzy thickness before it goes into guitar amp type distortion, so push it a little like you would drive a guitar amp with a boost pedal. It works for some things, but can cloud and congest some things as well.
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