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Post by matt@IAA on Jun 20, 2019 12:56:43 GMT -6
I picked up a design I'd set aside for a bit and I'm at a point where I have the functionality where I want, but maybe not the feature set. I'd love some input from y'all. The design uses a VCA for the compression action, but discrete op amps and transformers for the rest of the audio path (think API 2500-ish). The sidechain is not a clone, and some of the timing methods I'm using are pretty novel (at least, I think they are, and the guys at THAT Corp got kinda nerd-excited about it). In terms of speed, time constants vary from 1-40 msec. The release rate can be set to follow the time constant, a fixed rate from 50msec to 5 seconds, or a dynamic auto setting. Feedforward or feedback compression, manual makeup gain, hard/soft knee selection, and and variable ratio round out the knobs. Just so you have an idea of whats going on. So having said that... Do you use high and low pass sidechain filters when you use compressors? Would ya rather have fixed filters at a button (say, LF, HF, or both for bandpass) or separate sweepable LF / HF filters? Which would you rather have? - stereo box with one set of controls
- a stereo box with two sets of controls and a link / independent switch... when linked, one set of controls would do nothing
- a mono box with the option to stereo link two units
Is being able to variably link the two sides a useful feature?
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Post by EmRR on Jun 20, 2019 13:45:00 GMT -6
Variable link is a useful feature.
No use for a LPF filter. Prefer more options in a HPF.
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Post by drbill on Jun 20, 2019 13:47:27 GMT -6
- Stereo Box, stereo set of controls.
- Linked / unlinked option ala Manley VariMu
- Yes on the High Pass. Low Pass might be interesting too. Not variable. Maybe 3-5 well chosen SWITCHED freq's.
- MUST have a blend / Mix function between wet / dry
- Smaller is better. 1RU wins, 2RU may be acceptable if it's spectacular. 3RU looses unless it's completely unique, awesome and something I absolutely cannot live without.
- Well thought out and chosen switched controls are a bonus that plays BIG, HUGE in my world. Variable controls suck now. I'll give up a minute amount of versatility for the ability for everything to be switched and easily recalled and set quickly. I don't care if it's not ultimately tweak able. If done right, switched is enough.
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Post by matt@IAA on Jun 20, 2019 14:35:46 GMT -6
- Stereo Box, stereo set of controls. - Linked / unlinked option ala Manley VariMu - Yes on the High Pass. Low Pass might be interesting too. Not variable. Maybe 3-5 well chosen SWITCHED freq's. - MUST have a blend / Mix function between wet / dry - Smaller is better. 1RU wins, 2RU may be acceptable if it's spectacular. 3RU looses unless it's completely unique, awesome and something I absolutely cannot live without. - Well thought out and chosen switched controls are a bonus that plays BIG, HUGE in my world. Variable controls suck now. I'll give up a minute amount of versatility for the ability for everything to be switched and easily recalled and set quickly. I don't care if it's not ultimately tweak able. If done right, switched is enough. Stereo set of controls meaning two sets and one becomes a dummy in stereo? Or one set? |
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Post by drbill on Jun 20, 2019 15:23:44 GMT -6
- Stereo Box, stereo set of controls. - Linked / unlinked option ala Manley VariMu - Yes on the High Pass. Low Pass might be interesting too. Not variable. Maybe 3-5 well chosen SWITCHED freq's. - MUST have a blend / Mix function between wet / dry - Smaller is better. 1RU wins, 2RU may be acceptable if it's spectacular. 3RU looses unless it's completely unique, awesome and something I absolutely cannot live without. - Well thought out and chosen switched controls are a bonus that plays BIG, HUGE in my world. Variable controls suck now. I'll give up a minute amount of versatility for the ability for everything to be switched and easily recalled and set quickly. I don't care if it's not ultimately tweak able. If done right, switched is enough. Stereo set of controls meaning two sets and one becomes a dummy in stereo? Or one set? One set. |
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Post by Blackdawg on Jun 20, 2019 15:32:54 GMT -6
I can go either way with stereo box and one set of controls or a dual monitor box with linking. Variable linking would be cool. 1U would be best.
Hpf for sure. Lpf..eh..maybe. some tilt stuff I've used is cool though. Agree that a switch with several dedicated freq is best vs variable.
Wet dry blend is a must!
Making an all stepped mastering version is always great I think. Drives cost up a lot but still great to have the option.
All variable controls are a bit of a turn off for me due to recall. I love using analog gear but I tend to not use it if I can't recall it fast.
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Post by jeremygillespie on Jun 20, 2019 19:37:29 GMT -6
I’m with Bill on this one with the exception of the controls. I prefer 2 sets with one side that controls the other for stereo link. It’s always great to be able to use a stereo comp on separate mono sources when tracking.
Switched knobs always.
HPF is always helpful.
XLR in’s and outs!!!!
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Post by shoe on Jun 22, 2019 13:55:00 GMT -6
I could go a couple ways on the controls. I think, if it means it can be 1U, one set of stereo controls is great. However, all of of the units I actually have are mono with a link function. I do like putting them in series sometimes for mono sources. Not sure of two formats are an option for you (same layout but one stereo and one mono with link in back).
If you do do a link, having a button on the front for it is really great. I hate having to go behind the rack to unplug cables or press buttons. Ruins the workflow/my back lol.
Switched SC HPF is very handy. I use the one on my 10DCFs nearly all the time. Those are good EQ points i think.
LPF...not sure I would use. However a De-esser mode would be nice. This would be more an extension of the HPF up to a couple khz ranges.
I wonder if it's possible to get the attack a little bit faster at the minimum (a setting or two under 1ms would be nice to have). I really like using an 1176 because of its fast reduction. I don't typically go all the way to 20microseconds though. I haven't measured what it is, but I am usually around 3 o'clock to noon on the attack.
Parallel mix is always nice. Makes NYComp quite a bit easier to process.
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Post by johneppstein on Jun 22, 2019 16:34:49 GMT -6
Two sets of controls, one becomes a dummy in stereo. I use my comps far more frequently in mono than in stereo,. so a stereo comp with one set of controls for both channels is a waste of money as I see it. Variable hi pass filter, mix control for parallel, variable link between channels. I see no point in a LPF. 2RU is about right. 1RU is too crowded, especially with 2 sets of controls. Metering for both level (switched input and output) and GR. GR really should be a mechanical meter if possible, I do a lot of stuff that just barely touches the comp, LED meters are too coarse.
Need external access to the sidechain.
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Post by sirthought on Jun 22, 2019 17:03:52 GMT -6
I think I agree with John's response.
I'd be okay without a variable knob on the HPF as long as the selectable frequencies actually have some decent range. Some I've seen only go as high as 50hz, which you might want to pass things at 100 or 150.
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Post by shoe on Jun 23, 2019 9:44:08 GMT -6
I think I agree with John's response. I'd be okay without a variable knob on the HPF as long as the selectable frequencies actually have some decent range. Some I've seen only go as high as 50hz, which you might want to pass things at 100 or 150. I go up to the 300hz on the 10DCF quite often myself, so I agree that a good range is needed. |
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Post by svart on Jun 25, 2019 9:58:37 GMT -6
It's gotta be able to pump hard. HARD. I can use software lookahead if I wanted super clean and transparent compression. I want my hardware for what it does best, and that's add the forgiving range, fatness and attack that VCA compressors are (almost) uniquely able to do.
Personally I don't believe in filtering the sidechain. If your mix needs a filter to sound right through the compressor, then it's likely that your mix's balance is wrong.
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Post by matt@IAA on Jul 3, 2019 13:30:19 GMT -6
Went ahead and ordered pcbs for the prototype. I took in y'alls feedback... here's what the feature set is (for now) 2RU Two completely independent channels and sidechains Discrete op amp balanced inputs Discrete op amp output amp with transformer balanced out External access to the sidechain All controls use Grayhill rotary switches (no pots, all stepped) Feedforward or feedback modes (selectable for either channel) Sidechain input filter with a two-pole Baxandall tilt, switchable in 3dB steps from -15 to +15 at 20Hz and 20kHz. -20 to +10 dB threshold Selectable hard / medium / soft knee behavior Nifty separated attack and release time constant circuits - six attack times from 0.1 ms to 30 ms, five release times from 0.1 sec to 1.2 sec and the sixth mode an auto-release inspired by the SSL bus comp Selectable ratio at 1.5, 2, 4, 6, 10 and inf:1 Selectable makeup gain from -20 to +20 dB Variable link ranging from completely independent behavior to 90% linking of mono channels - and then a separate switch to go to true stereo behavior Stereo selection shares the sidechain, so it disables one set of controls as well as disabling the link control ...it'll also have an on/off switch.  I haven't even looked at meters yet. |
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Post by Blackdawg on Jul 3, 2019 13:49:20 GMT -6
Damn dude. That sounds freaking great.
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Post by Guitar on Jul 3, 2019 22:03:22 GMT -6
Yeah, I'm into it! I love the clever sidechain EQ you decided on.
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Post by matt@IAA on Jul 10, 2019 18:19:09 GMT -6
Let the games begin..  |
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Post by Blackdawg on Jul 10, 2019 18:35:14 GMT -6
Pass the popcorn!
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Post by matt@IAA on Sept 20, 2019 17:18:23 GMT -6
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Post by johneppstein on Sept 24, 2019 17:45:06 GMT -6
Lookin' good!
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I haven't even looked at meters yet.
