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Post by M57 on Jun 9, 2019 8:29:28 GMT -6
I think I had a handle on the range of compression types. VCA, Opto, Vari-Mu, FET, but I stumbled on the IGS site and didn't understand where something like the IGS V8 fit in. It appears that a "diode-bridged" design is something that is mutually exclusive of the basic compressor types, but is it typically preferred in some over others. I see it's mentioned in a article about the Fairchild 670 so I know it's been around forever, but what does it do? Pros/Cons, etc.
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Post by EmRR on Jun 9, 2019 9:29:36 GMT -6
It's generally a Wheatstone bridge and you get variable attenuation by making two legs variable in value, thereby changing values in the attenuator formula. It's been done with triode tubes and with diodes, maybe some other techniques. It's still subject to side chain time constant design.
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Post by M57 on Jun 9, 2019 10:52:50 GMT -6
Thanks EmRR , but that's 301 talk. Legs, formulas, Wheatstones, and all.. You guys can go there for sure but.. ..I'm interested as a potential user. What makes it different? Is it popular, or out of favor? Sonically, what differentiates it from units that don't incorporate it? Where is it typically used? Mastering, Buss compression, Bass, Vocals, etc? Is it found more or less ubiquitously in all designs and sometimes shows up as marketing hype, or is it an atypical design element that has specific characteristics that caters to folks looking for a certain sound? |
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 9, 2019 11:22:29 GMT -6
Diode Bridge Compressors aren't nearly as prevalent as Optos/Fets/VCA's, but there are some pretty fantastic compressors that use that design. As reference, the Neve 2254/2264 and 33609 family of compressors are all Diode Bridge. I believe the Chandler Zener is too (someone correct me if I'm wrong). And then there's a few more modern comps like the Buzz Audio DBC and Radial Komit.
The Neve 2254 family of comps are great on drum buss and have tone for days. The Buzz Audio DBC is incredibly smooth and capable of 15db of gain reduction without you knowing it. Can't really speak to the others. Hope that helps.
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Post by M57 on Jun 9, 2019 11:35:33 GMT -6
Diode Bridge Compressors aren't nearly as prevalent as Optos/Fets/VCA's, but there are some pretty fantastic compressors that use that design. As reference, the Neve 2254/2264 and 33609 family of compressors are all Diode Bridge. I believe the Chandler Zener is too (someone correct me if I'm wrong). And then there's a few more modern comps like the Buzz Audio DBC and Radial Komit. The Neve 2254 family of comps are great on drum buss and have tone for days. The Buzz Audio DBC is incredibly smooth and capable of 15db of gain reduction without you knowing it. Can't really speak to the others. Hope that helps. It's a start - so it sounds like Diode Bridge doesn't impart any coloration (or does it?), and is mostly found in Vari-Mu designs. Drum Buss? Not the first place that would cross my mind for a Vari-Mu compressor. |
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Post by matt@IAA on Jun 9, 2019 11:58:21 GMT -6
It gets hard to make distinctions between method of gain reduction and amplifier tone. Tone can be by the amplifier itself. So you could use different gain reduction methods and still get similar tone. Different gain reduction methods probably have more to do with the amount and type of distortion caused by the action of the compressor. But that is a different kind of tone than amplifier tone. Imagine for example a VCA compressor with a Neve input transformer, and a BA283 output stage. Neve tone, but VCA gain reduction.
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 9, 2019 11:59:39 GMT -6
Diode Bridge Compressors aren't nearly as prevalent as Optos/Fets/VCA's, but there are some pretty fantastic compressors that use that design. As reference, the Neve 2254/2264 and 33609 family of compressors are all Diode Bridge. I believe the Chandler Zener is too (someone correct me if I'm wrong). And then there's a few more modern comps like the Buzz Audio DBC and Radial Komit. The Neve 2254 family of comps are great on drum buss and have tone for days. The Buzz Audio DBC is incredibly smooth and capable of 15db of gain reduction without you knowing it. Can't really speak to the others. Hope that helps. It's a start - so it sounds like Diode Bridge doesn't impart any coloration (or does it?), and is mostly found in Vari-Mu designs. Drum Buss? Not the first place that would cross my mind for a Vari-Mu compressor. Vari-Mu are a different design than diode bridge, although they can have similar compression characteristics. Vari-Mu's achieve gain reduction through the biasing of a tube. With a vari-mu the ratio increases as the signal its being fed increases. So "softer" sounds are compressed less, and "louder" sounds are compressed more. Make sense? Some Diode Bridge Designs use this same scheme (like the Buzz DBC), but many have a selectable fixed ratio, like the Neve 2254/33609. |
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Post by Ward on Jun 9, 2019 12:49:15 GMT -6
Audioscapes D-Comp is also a Diode Bridge comp. And it'a fantastic on drum buss or 2-buss!! It's a complete toolkit for designing transients.
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Post by EmRR on Jun 9, 2019 12:58:33 GMT -6
Thanks EmRR , but that's 301 talk. Legs, formulas, Wheatstones, and all.. You guys can go there for sure but.. ..I'm interested as a potential user. What makes it different? Is it popular, or out of favor? Sonically, what differentiates it from units that don't incorporate it? Where is it typically used? Mastering, Buss compression, Bass, Vocals, etc? Is it found more or less ubiquitously in all designs and sometimes shows up as marketing hype, or is it an atypical design element that has specific characteristics that caters to folks looking for a certain sound? There are a ton of variations and they all sound different, and they might work a bunch of different jobs, or not. There's a broad thing they sorta all do, but you also might mistake them for another type. There is no simple wrap-up as you seek. You have to hear a number of them and find your own links. |
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Post by M57 on Jun 9, 2019 13:43:28 GMT -6
It's a start - so it sounds like Diode Bridge doesn't impart any coloration (or does it?), and is mostly found in Vari-Mu designs. Drum Buss? Not the first place that would cross my mind for a Vari-Mu compressor. Vari-Mu are a different design than diode bridge, although they can have similar compression characteristics. Vari-Mu's achieve gain reduction through the biasing of a tube. Now I'm confused - I thought Vari-Mu and diode bridged are NOT mutually exclusive designs. I.e, you can have both in the same piece of hardware. Isn't the D-comp a VCA and the Fairchild 670 Vari-Mu, yet both incorporate a diode bridged design? I'm clearly missing something here. |
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 10, 2019 19:09:21 GMT -6
Vari-Mu are a different design than diode bridge, although they can have similar compression characteristics. Vari-Mu's achieve gain reduction through the biasing of a tube. Now I'm confused - I thought Vari-Mu and diode bridged are NOT mutually exclusive designs. I.e, you can have both in the same piece of hardware. Isn't the D-comp a VCA and the Fairchild 670 Vari-Mu, yet both incorporate a diode bridged design? I'm clearly missing something here. A diode bridge is its own, unique, gain reduction circuit. As opposed to an Opto cell, vari-mu (vacuum tube), Fet etc. I can see where some confusion with vari-mu’s might stem from however. Many comps have tubes in them, like the La2a, but only vari-mu comps use the tube for gain reduction. It’s the difference between a Fairchild (vari-mu) and an la2a (opto), even though both are often referred to as “tube compressors”. Hope that clears some things up. |
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Post by M57 on Jun 11, 2019 4:27:56 GMT -6
Thanks, Tbone81 So if I understand correctly, when listing the compressor types, diode bridge deserves it's own category - separate from FET, Opto, Vari-mu, and VCA. I think part of what has confused me is that I don't recall ever seeing mention of DB compressors in any compressor primer, 50 top compressors article, etc.. Why begs the question.. Given how long it's been around, why? Has it fallen out of favor? |
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Post by Tbone81 on Jun 11, 2019 10:37:50 GMT -6
They’re certainly more rare but I couldn’t tell you why. I imagine it has to do with some difficulty in implementation, and being able to “do it right”. But, the Neve 2254 and 33609 are certainly classic comps that are well sought after.
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Post by EmRR on Jun 11, 2019 10:46:13 GMT -6
You gotta remember there are major variations that can swamp what you think is a 'type'. SSL and DBX are both VCA comps, totally different approaches and sounds because the sidechain concept is different. Same goes with bridge types.
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